Who's Worse Jimmy Carter or George W Bush?

[Rockindeano]

Um, no genius. I was NEVER banned.

[SuiteMadameBlue]

Um, yes you were "genius" - LOL Dean and genius in the same sentence, way too funny!! LOL I'm kidding!!!!

Oh, excuse me, given "a vacation" or "a holiday" a few times or so. Don't give me your crap today, I'm right and you're wrong !

[Rockindeano]

Bro, I am NEVER wrong. You of all people should know this. Andrew tried to flex up on me, and I simply said, "no, I will not ne banned." he agreed.

[Zan]

I take it back. Who was I to say this debate wasn't mature and well-executed. I stand corrected, thanks for proving me wrong. LOL

[Rockindeano]

No offence here Zan, but TNC, froy, Monker, Lordoftherings and myself, all weighed in and debated facts and issues.

Sure is easy to armchair quarterback. By all means, if you have something so much more intelligent to say, let's hear it.

[Zan]

Sure is easy to armchair quarterback. By all means, if you have something so much more intelligent to say, let's hear it.

sigh...

It was sarcasm, Dean. It went from a debate that has no place here to a pissing contest with Suite about whether you've been banned or not. That was what I was commenting on, not the actual content of the "discussion."

I've already given you my reasons for not getting involved in this subject here. Been there, done that, got the T-shirt. Intelligent or not, valid points or not, it just doesn't belong on a music board.

And using "Froy started it" as an excuse is laughable because nobody here takes anything he says seriously.

[Rockindeano]

So just to clear it up, it's all Suites fault. Cool.

Sorry Zan, it's hard to read sarcasm through type.

[Rockindeano]

And using "Froy started it" as an excuse is laughable because nobody here takes anything he says seriously. [/color][/b]

I am sorry about that too. I thought froy was your fearless Styx leader. I hardly ever come over here.

[SuiteMadameBlue]

Yeah it's my fault - good one!

This is the comment on this thread that I was responding to:

O come on, Zan. Much like I am associated with the Journey board, froy is linked to the Styx Board.

Your boy meant "Styx board's very own" not your personal boy, dummy

[Monker]

I wonder if he will give the richest 1% another tax break this year as they must be really struggling to pay these gas prices......... maybe he will cut the veteran's pay to pay for it again ?

Nah, he's too busy trying to figure out a way to invade Iran.

[Monker]

Do you really think if Gore was elected in 2000 that he would have put any money into the Defense of this country or do you think he would have said to Bin Laden not to do it again.

I think any other president would have went after Bin Laden in AFGHANISTAN. I doubt any other President without the last name of "Bush" would have attacked Iraq.

You can call our President all the names you want, but it is all of our best interests that he is successfull.

It's in all of our best interest that he leaves office and is replaced by someone who hasn't given froyline their brain.

[Monker]

No offence here Zan, but TNC, froy, Monker, Lordoftherings and myself, all weighed in and debated facts and issues.

That doesn't mean I agree that it should be here. But, hey, Styx sucks, so why not talk about other things that suck, like GWB. That way, it's on topic!

[Rockindeano]

You can call our President all the names you want, but it is all of our best interests that he is successfull.

Not really.

The United States is constructed in a way where there are provisions and a limited built in protection to prevent all clear wipe outs of a selected people. In other words, it will take some time for W to wipe out all the blacks and other minorities, try as he might.

Having said that, If "President Bush" is successful, how does that help me? I want the fucker to fail so miserably and fall on his face so that Americans never even think twice about voting for a republican or a guy named Bush. Remember, there is another in line. let's hope W messed it up so bad, Jeb never sees the light of day.

[The_Noble_Cause]

I think any other president would have went after Bin Laden in AFGHANISTAN. I doubt any other President without the last name of "Bush" would have attacked Iraq.

Jon McCain has repeatedly expressed his desire to stay in Iraq. You just said you would vote for the guy. How can you be anti-Iraq war and then turn around and say you would proudly vote for this war's most hawkish proponent?
Care to reconcile the two?

[Rockindeano]

NOTHING gets by the Cause..NOTHING.

[Monker]

I think any other president would have went after Bin Laden in AFGHANISTAN. I doubt any other President without the last name of "Bush" would have attacked Iraq.

Jon McCain has repeatedly expressed his desire to stay in Iraq. You just said you would vote for the guy. How can you be anti-Iraq war and then turn around and say you would proudly vote for this war's most hawkish proponent?
Care to reconcile the two?

Because we are in Iraq *right now*. It doesn't matter if it's McCain or Kerry or HR Clinton. The fact is *I* would trust McCain to do the right thing in Iraq more then any Democrat's name being tossed around.

And, it's politics. He can't win the nomination without neo-conservative support. I am sure he knows that from the last time around.

[The_Noble_Cause]

The fact is *I* would trust McCain to do the right thing in Iraq more then any Democrat's name being tossed around.

At least there's a chance a Dem would bring the troops home.
McCain has already explicitly said that he would keep the troops there and in fact, would add many more.
Is that what you want?
More innocent blood on Uncle Sam's white satin gloved hands?
You're one sick pup.
Did Journey's "Out of Harms Way" teach you nothing, you belligerent war-mongering bastard?

He can't win the nomination without neo-conservative support. I am sure he knows that from the last time around.

Outside of a close-knit cabal comprised of Rummy, Wolfowitz, Cheney and Rice, there is no NEO-Conservative vote. There is no NEO-con constituency that needs to be catered to in order to carry an election, have you lost your mind?

[Rockindeano]

The fact is *I* would trust McCain to do the right thing in Iraq more then any Democrat's name being tossed around.

Haha. mcCain is really a Democrat in a rich GOP suite. He had to pick GOP in AZ to win.

At least there's a chance a Dem would bring the troops home.

I hope not. That would be the worst possible scenario. Cut and run. Were we right to go in the first place? No. Does it make it right to bail out? Even worse..

McCain has already explicitly said that he would keep the troops there and in fact, would add many more.

I agree. We should.

Is that what you want?
More innocent blood on Uncle Sam's white satin gloved hands?

You're one sick pup.
Did Journey's "Out of Harms Way" teach you nothing, you belligerent war-mongering bastard?

He can't win the nomination without neo-conservative support. I am sure he knows that from the last time around.

The blood is on Bush's hands. He has to live with it. So does Wolfowitz, Cheney and Rumsfeld.

Outside of a close-knit cabal comprised of Rummy, Wolfowitz, Cheney and Rice, there is no NEO-Conservative vote. There is no NEO-con constituency that needs to be catered to in order to carry an election, have you lost your mind?

Quite true. Well said.

[The_Noble_Cause]

Haha. mcCain is really a Democrat in a rich GOP suite. He had to pick GOP in AZ to win.

He's a pasty faced freak show of a man no matter what he's tailored in.

That would be the worst possible scenario. Cut and run. Were we right to go in the first place? No. Does it make it right to bail out?

That's what's gonna happen anyway. The question is how many more lives do we need to sacrifice before it happens.

Even worse..

Not really. It's Bush's war. Not America's.
Cut bait and have Dubya foot the bill.

I agree. We should.

Then go register, cowboy.

The blood is on Bush's hands. He has to live with it. So does Wolfowitz, Cheney and Rumsfeld.

So remind me again....why should America suffer for one man's insatiable thirst for blood?

[Rockindeano]

FYI Cause, I DID go to Iraq. I was there the first go round, and hated every living second. However, it was conducted brilliantly, and we had leadership who didn't lie to us.

I can remember being about 50 Kilos into Iraq, and all of a sudden, about 200 Iraqis came running towards us. We shot at them, but over their heads. There was no reason to shoot them...It wasn't their fault. These guys wanted no part of war. They had mixed outfits on, different coloured socks, NO socks, and some missing their shoes.

The first words out of their mouth?

KFC. KFC. Bastards were starving. I gave a guy my MRE(Meal Ready to Eat), and he said it was shit. Made me feel good to be there.

Awful place. If Bush was honest and wanted to truly liberate Iraqi's, he would bring them here instead. NO ONE should have to live there. I would rather live in Mexico.

[AnnieOprah]

You can call our President all the names you want, but it is all of our best interests that he is successfull.

Not really.

The United States is constructed in a way where there are provisions and a limited built in protection to prevent all clear wipe outs of a selected people. In other words, it will take some time for W to wipe out all the blacks and other minorities, try as he might.

Having said that, If "President Bush" is successful, how does that help me? I want the fucker to fail so miserably and fall on his face so that Americans never even think twice about voting for a republican or a guy named Bush. Remember, there is another in line. let's hope W messed it up so bad, Jeb never sees the light of day.

That statement is the problem with politics. You want Bush to fail so Americans will not vote for a Republican. But the problem is that if Bush fails, America fails. So, why would you wish ill will on your country? If Bush fails, then more deaths occur and America's place in the world becomes worse than it already is. Wouldn't you rather America succeed, and you let the people's will dictate who will be their next leader?

[The_Noble_Cause]

That statement is the problem with politics. You want Bush to fail so Americans will not vote for a Republican. But the problem is that if Bush fails, America fails.

WRONG. If Iraq fails, that redounds on Bush.
Not on Average Joe P. Yankee Doodle American.

So, why would you wish ill will on your country?

Stop conflating Bush's misbegotten conquestidorial policies with loving one's country. That is such a Faux News tactic.
When the anchors can't possibly defend policy, they turn and in a last ditch effort to save face, ask the person, "why do you hate America?"

If Bush fails, then more deaths occur and America's place in the world becomes worse than it already is.

The death rate has increased pretty steadily.
Open your eyes.
Bush has failed.
It's over.

Wouldn't you rather America succeed, and you let the people's will dictate who will be their next leader?

We are talking facts here, lady.
Iraq is an umitigated disaster. It doesn't matter what I or Deano *would prefer* or *wish* to have happen. It's too late for that.
Succesful foreign policy is neither built nor sustained upon wishful thinking.

[Monker]

At least there's a chance a Dem would bring the troops home.

Bringing the troups home now without a complete victory is WRONG. IMO, it's a war that should never have happened...But, since it DID HAPPEN, we MUST follow through with what we said we would do or the region will be even more destabilized.

McCain has already explicitly said that he would keep the troops there and in fact, would add many more.
Is that what you want?

Quite frankly, I don't think there is any choice.

More innocent blood on Uncle Sam's white satin gloved hands?
You're one sick pup.

That's what we got ourselves into. That is what the American people supported when they reelected Bush. If they can't stomach the war, then they voted for the wrong party. He's a self-proclaimed "war-time" president.

If to get a stable democracy in Iraq, we have to send our entire army and all of our marines over there and have an armed machine gun ever ten feet or so, then that is what we should do.

Bush fucked up the war from the start. Somebody has to clean it up, and the economy, and everything else Bush's Medusa like face gazed at.

Did Journey's "Out of Harms Way" teach you nothing, you belligerent war-mongering bastard?

What is it supposed to teach me? That war is hell...that it takes a kid and can change him in some very negative ways? That war causes people to die? That war causes innocent people to die? That seeing your friends blow up in front of you is a bit traumatic?

Again, that's what we are in. That is what this country wanted. They just didn't expect it to be a half-assed effort with all kinds of screwed up decisions.

Outside of a close-knit cabal comprised of Rummy, Wolfowitz, Cheney and Rice, there is no NEO-Conservative vote. There is no NEO-con constituency that needs to be catered to in order to carry an election, have you lost your mind?

I didn't say 'election'. I said NOMINATION. You can't be a moderate Republican and be nominated. You have to be a right-wing, pro-military, bible thumping, anti-abortion, conservative in order to be nominated by the Republican party. The very IDEA that McCain was pro-choice, and not supported by the Christian right, lost him the nomination last time.

And, I definitely think McCain can kick HR Clinton's ass. I doubt it would even be close...after they "swift boat" her...which won't be too difficult.

[The_Noble_Cause]

Bringing the troups home now without a complete victory is WRONG.

It's people like you who rue the day we ever left Vietnam
YOU want this war to wage on endlessly for time immemorial?
Then go sign your kids up to die, and if they're inelligible, you go.

IMO, it's a war that should never have happened...But, since it DID HAPPEN, we MUST follow through with what we said we would do

Yup. Because as everyone clearly knows, upon realizing you've made a collosal blunder, the best thing to do is to repeat that error again and again and again and......

or the region will be even more destabilized.

Who cares.
Let's provide every American with health insurance first and then we can begin to worry about other peoples trifling problems.
Let them pound sand.

McCain has already explicitly said that he would keep the troops there and in fact, would add many more.
Is that what you want?

Quite frankly, I don't think there is any choice.

Wow. I'm taken aback.
Only a bonafide sadist thinks like that.
You don't think there is any other option aside from more kids willfully falling atop the bayonet of the U.S. Government?
Here's a revolutionary idea: GET THEM THE FUCK OUTTA THERE!!!

That's what we got ourselves into. That is what the American people supported when they reelected Bush.

Quit it with the sweeping generalizations.
I, personally, didn't get myself into anything.
To invoke a fitting Simpsons quote;
"Don't Blame Me I Voted For Kudos ".

If to get a stable democracy in Iraq, we have to send our entire army and all of our marines over there and have an armed machine gun ever ten feet or so, then that is what we should do.

Ok, remind me again, why have you yet to sign up, gun slinger?

Bush fucked up the war from the start. Somebody has to clean it up, and the economy, and everything else Bush's Medusa like face gazed at.

But a vote for McCain is a vote to extend Bush's status quo policies of doom and gloom.
Why would you wish for more of the same?
(Oh that's right, I forgot, as established above, you're a proud sadist)

You have to be a right-wing, pro-military, bible thumping, anti-abortion, conservative in order to be nominated by the Republican party.

You said he needed Neo-Conservative support to get a nom.
Most of the above mentioned tenets have very little-to-nothing to do with Neo-Conservatism.

The very IDEA that McCain was pro-choice, and not supported by the Christian right, lost him the nomination last time.

Again, nothing to do with NEO-Conservatism.

And, I definitely think McCain can kick HR Clinton's ass. I doubt it would even be close.

McCain has all the political and social tact of Uncle Fester.
A stammering pasty faced circus freak.
I'd love to see him go head to head against Hillary.
In fact, I'd love to see him try to go head-to-head against anything with a pulse.
Bring it on!