Maybe the breakup in the 80's was...........

[classicstyxfan]

a good thing !

I just saw the video for Music Time for the 1st time on VH-1 Classic.
Yeah, it was humorous, but that Music ( and I use that term loosely )
was so NOT STYX !!!! For the 1st couple of seconds, I thought it was a DEVO video !

If that's the direction Dennis wanted to go, then I am glad they all walked away when they did.........Maybe the 6 year hiatus saved them from a very sad decent to god knows what !

[froy]

a good thing !

I just saw the video for Music Time for the 1st time on VH-1 Classic.
Yeah, it was humorous, but that Music ( and I use that term loosely )
was so NOT STYX !!!! For the 1st couple of seconds, I thought it was a DEVO video !

If that's the direction Dennis wanted to go, then I am glad they all walked away when they did.........Maybe the 6 year hiatus saved them from a very sad decent to god knows what !

Its really funny how we always hear about the direction Styx was about to go in and how it would have been a disaster if they let Dennis get his way,
This is simply ridiculous ,
Look at Queen and the great Freddie Mercury how many different directions did they go into through out there career?
How about the music video for I want To Break Free when they alll dressed up as girls.
Did they throw Freddie out when he came up with these wacko ideas?
No way The man was loved by the entire band.

Now we have Styx and the many directions Dennis supposedly wanted to take the band,
What did we get from Tom and Jim nothing but spite and hatred towards the guy who came up with winner after winner
They were the first ones to spit on the guy when he went into directions they felt were wrong for the band,
Im sure Tom had nothing good to say about there number 1 hit Babe but the rest of the world loved it and voted it a number 1 song,

Could you see Tom and Jim in Queen when Freddie said lets dress up like chicks and do this song ?
How fast would he have been talked about behind his back ?
The point is Tom and Jim sang the praises of Dennis when the money was flying in but when the going got rough the 2 guys totally spit on the guy who got them to the dance,

Now there is nobody standing in there way they are free to do whatever they choose that has brought a covers cd with half ass concerts bad sound and Manic Depressive in the setlist the worst song of Toms carreer.

Boy the future looks terrible for Almost STYX<

[sadie65]

a good thing !

I just saw the video for Music Time for the 1st time on VH-1 Classic.
Yeah, it was humorous, but that Music ( and I use that term loosely )
was so NOT STYX !!!! For the 1st couple of seconds, I thought it was a DEVO video !

If that's the direction Dennis wanted to go, then I am glad they all walked away when they did.........Maybe the 6 year hiatus saved them from a very sad decent to god knows what !

I think the split was inevitable at that point. It must be hard for any band with such differing personalities to sustain the pace they were on. Add to it the growing differences of opinion about band direction and well, it was a recipe for the split.

As for Music Time, I think this was an attempt to be current with the music of the day. It was humorous and silly, and nothing many other artists haven't done in their lives. I don't know that based on that song, it proves or disproves what direction Dennis wanted to go in. ANd now, it really doesn't matter.

I've read numerous comments about a song/songs off Cyclorama that remind people of Blink 182. Isn't that somewhat the same thing as what Music Time was? An attempt to be current with the music that is out there at the time.

Admittedly, Music Time isn't in my top 10, but I guess I can take it for what it was.

Good topic.

Sadie

[classicstyxfan]

Froy,

I really don't know if that ( more Music in that style ) is indeed what the future would have held for them if they stayed together or not....
BUT if that would have been the case, I am glad they "just said no" to quote a popular phrasae from that era. The VIDEO was mildly entertaining, but the music was sub par for the band in my opinion.

Froy, even you have to admit DDY has had a few "stinkers" over the course of his career, as have almost all of the great artists in Rock music.

[froy]

Froy,

I really don't know if that ( more Music in that style ) is indeed what the future would have held for them if they stayed together or not....
BUT if that would have been the case, I am glad they "just said no" to quote a popular phrasae from that era. The VIDEO was mildly entertaining, but the music was sub par for the band in my opinion.

Froy, even you have to admit DDY has had a few "stinkers" over the course of his career, as have almost all of the great artists in Rock music.

Of course Dennis had some crap tunes
First Time being a good example but you wanna know something there are friends i know that actually like that tune and thats my point
We all dont like the same music
I like Music Time its not as bad as Hip Hop or Manic Depresant or Cold War.
I really think the band with Dennis deserves a few bad tunes every band has them , But to use it as an excuse to get rid of a member is just ridiculous ,

[yogi]

If you are going to put one new release on a 'Greatest Hits ' live CD you at least should try to put on a decent song. Styx was still VERY VERY popular back when Caught In The Act came out. Proof of that was that horrible horrible tune made it into the top 40. Music Time was an absolute horse shit AWEFUL, PUTRID song. How the hell could that song reach #40?? It reached because the name Styx still had some major stroke back in 1985.

If any of you out there purchased the single Id love to know who you are. Ive never even seen it on Ebay. Maybe it reaching # 40 was a mistake, because no one ever purchased the single. What was on the flip side??? if it was High Time,or Cold War that could of been the WORST 45 ever sold!!

There is no point to this post other than to say that its a sad sad day when Music Time can reach # 40 and songs such as Bam, Superboy, Another, Roseland, These Are the Times, One With Everything, Paradise, Stop Knockin, Its All In How You Say It, and so so many others have no chance of charting.

[Abitaman]

If any of you out there purchased the single Id love to know who you are. Ive never even seen it on Ebay. Maybe it reaching # 40 was a mistake, because no one ever purchased the single. What was on the flip side??? if it was High Time, that could of been the WORST 45 ever sold!!

There is no point to this post other than to say that its a sad sad day when Music Time can reach # 40 and songs such as Bam, Superboy, Another, Roseland, These Are the Times, One With Everything, Paradise, Stop Knockin, Its All In How You Say It, and so so many others have no chance of charting.

I have Music Time the single on 45. Still have the cover to it too! Was a teenager, and was out of town in a bowling tournment. Bought Music Time and the cd CITA that weekend. Time I got back come, clear across state I had worn out CITA, and had to but a new one, which I did along with the album of it!
MUsic Time is not my fav. song by Styx, and I can not say that is the direction Styx was going in, I think it was a style they were trying. Look at Dennis first solo cd, that was great. I think if Styx would have had a new cd that year, it would have been more toward DM.
IT IS SUPERHARD for any classic rock band to get on top 40 now adays, with or without Dennis Styx would have to climb a mountain, same with Journey, with or without Perry, it would be next to impossible!
I wish they would zome back into the top 40, and prove they ( and Dennis), are still making great music-ERIC

[gr8dane]

Trying to look at the bright side,I got about 10 or 11 albums of great music from one band so far.How often does that happen??
Yes ,that does include Cyclorama.

[BlackWall]

What's interesting is, it's not as if the band jumped ship on Dennis because they hated/refused to do this style of music; if I'm not mistaken, wasn't Tommy the only one who left, and the rest of the guys would have kept going as Styx, but Dennis decided to go solo, not wanting to continue as a group without Shaw?

As for "Music Time".. I can understand why some people don't care for it, it's very much an '80s pop song, and a pretty big departure from what Styx had been(save for Kilroy), but I don't really see anything wrong with experimenting with different styles, and DeYoung had been doing a lot of that since "Cornerstone". Now, if this is what Styx would have become, just song after song like this, then, that's another story..

I agree with Abitaman, I think the future of Styx in the '80s would have been a lot like DeYoung's solo material, since he seemed to have the majority of the control, with a mix of some of what Shaw and Young did solo.. Do you guys find "Don't Wait For Heroes", "This Is The Time" and "Boomchild" as annoying as "Music Time", cause I'm pretty sure this would have been the Styx of the mid to late '80s.

For me, I'd have to say that maybe the best days for the original lineup were over by '84.. I can't judge Shaw or J.Y's solo material, I've never heard any of it, but I know Dennis seemed to be running out of gas, and maybe they all just needed a creative break. Dennis had a few strong moments, "Desert Moon", "Black Wall", and maybe even "Boomchild", but then there were songs like.. "Dear Darlin'"..

[bugsymalone]

I feel that a song like Music Time needs to be looked at in context. Videos were exploding in the 80’s and if you weren’t doing music and making videos, you were going to fade very quickly.

Every single group of that time was doing videos and often they were outlandish and cartoonish, as was Music Time. Spend a day looking at retro videos from the 80’s and you will see big-name groups placed in all manner of video silliness.

Good songs or bad songs, I think Dennis was simply trying to do something different and, above all, stay relevant.

No one argues that many felt it was the end of Styx when this happened, but status quo in the age of video was not a good option.

Though not my favorite song either, Music Time fit right into the times musically and visually. And I personally get a big kick out of the video. It has some hilarious moments in it and that was what it was all about.

Bugsy

[Zan]

What's interesting is, it's not as if the band jumped ship on Dennis because they hated/refused to do this style of music; if I'm not mistaken, wasn't Tommy the only one who left, and the rest of the guys would have kept going as Styx, but Dennis decided to go solo, not wanting to continue as a group without Shaw?

According to BTM, Chuck made reference to "everyone" leaving with the one-fingered salute. That doesn't sound like anyone was real fired up about staying together at that point.

[ek88]

As for Music Time, I think this was an attempt to be current with the music of the day.

Music Time fit right into the times musically and visually.

Too many bands (IMO) fall into this trap. The legacy of Styx wasn't built with corny videos or by trying to fit in with the times. It was built with hard work, quality music, outstanding musicianship, and a unique sound, not to mention a bit of aggressive marketing and some help from a certain DJ

I think it was a foolish move (regardless of who was responsible) for them to switch gears like they did in the 80s. Sure, Babe and the PT album were a bit of a departure, but still well within the context of the original Styx sound, IMO. If in fact Kilroy and Music Time were an attempt to be relevant or modern, it wasn't a worthwhile tradeoff. It cheapened their integrity (musically speaking), as far as I am concerned, but possibly sold them more albums in the short term. (Although I think KWH and the Music Time single sold more on the merits of the Styx name than anything else).

I certainly don't pretend to have talked to enough people to draw any significant conclusions, but many friends I visit with wanted nothing to do with Styx after hearing Roboto and the rest of Kilroy. They were content just to continue to listen to the classic albums. Had the band (AS A WHOLE) been more concerned with collaborating on a more STYX-sounding album, and less with videos and fitting in, who knows how the post-PT years may have gone.

Although I do have to admit, both Tommy and DDY were very good at the whole fitting in routine. Both of their 80's solo albums (excepting the Desert Moon single) fit in quite nicely with all the other one-hit wonder/forgettable flavor-of-the-year music that dominated the airwaves back then. You know, the bands that haven't been heard from for years except for VH-1's pathetic attempts to keep them alive (Bands Reunited, I Love The 80's) probably to justify why they were all on MTV so much back in the day.

Okay, I'm now stepping down from the soapbox, and will now end my "music philosophy according to ek88" rant. Thanks for reading and my apologies to those who are now sick to their stomach

[sadie65]

I respectfully disagree. I honestly think it is a matter of what you like. For everyone fan that didn't like the direction of Kilroy, there were fans who became aware of and liked the band as a result of Kilroy.

I myself don't think the band sold out by doing Kilroy or Music Time. I think they expanded their creativity. If you look at their Wooden Nickel material, on to the A & M material, EOTC material, BNW material, and even Cyclorama, in each case there was always change and an effort to be current. Actually I think that's pretty impressive for any band to even make the effort.

I don't know that solo material indicates that's the direction the band would have gone in. I tend to think for people in a band who then do solo projects they are more of a labor of love, if you will, not necessairly an indication of what the band should do. I've heard and read several artists who have done just that, and nearly all have said that their solo work was done because it wasn't the sound they wanted for the band, but rather something they wanted to express themselves.

Peace,

Sadie

[froy]

I myself don't think the band sold out by doing Kilroy or Music Time. I think they expanded their creativity. If you look at their Wooden Nickel material, on to the A & M material, EOTC material, BNW material, and even Cyclorama, in each case there was always change and an effort to be current.

And now look and what is going on that trend has been halted
You can now honestly say with this next release they have sold out
They are not expanding there creativity with a covers cd.

[ek88]

If you look at their Wooden Nickel material, on to the A & M material, EOTC material, BNW material, and even Cyclorama, in each case there was always change and an effort to be current.

Point well taken. I guess when I listen to the Wooden Nickel stuff and then the A&M releases up until PT, I still hear an underlying Styx sound that I cannot seem to find anywhere on Kilroy Was Here. I don't mind an effort to be current, but Kilroy (to me) sounds like they tried too hard.

I honestly think it is a matter of what you like. For everyone fan that didn't like the direction of Kilroy, there were fans who became aware of and liked the band as a result of Kilroy.

But if this math is true, shouldn't Kilroy have outsold the previous albums, or at least sold the same? I mean, I can't stand it (okay, maybe I like it a little bit), yet I have a copy. Surely there are others like me. And even if some refused to buy it, if Kilroy was bringing new fans on board, shouldn't it have balanced out?

I don't know that solo material indicates that's the direction the band would have gone in. I tend to think for people in a band who then do solo projects they are more of a labor of love, if you will, not necessairly an indication of what the band should do.

I agree entirely. I'm glad you said that, because many have thrown Tommy's words about Styx going soft in his face (myself included) based on his solo albums. I just like getting a shot in on VH-1 whenever I can, even at the expense of the Styx boys

[Ash]

sobering thought.


The "classic" styx never truly reunited after the 1984 break up. The last time all five of the classic members of styx shared the stage at the same time was over 20 years ago on the final show of the kilroy tour.....

[Ash]

Though not my favorite song either, Music Time fit right into the times musically and visually. And I personally get a big kick out of the video. It has some hilarious moments in it and that was what it was all about.

Bugsy

The video shows off the funny, not-so-serious side of the band that Dennis had said existed but nobody ever saw.

The Music Time video is brilliant. I like it a lot more than I like the song. You may not like the song, but the video is REALLY very well done. Even more so than the Roboto video which many considered groundbreaking at the time.

[bugsymalone]

You may not like the song, but the video is REALLY very well done. Even more so than the Roboto video which many considered groundbreaking at the time.

Mind you, I do not hate Music Time. It is not among my favorite Styx songs, but I sort of enjoyed its total departure from the Styx catalog.

Nothing wrong with having a little fun.

As to the video. It is chock full of wonderful sight gags, and every time I see it I see something new, or just laugh at the parts I know I always enjoy.

LOVE the BIG burgers scene! And the conehead spacemen!

Every single Styx video up to that point, other than the manic Mr. Roboto, had been a lip-synched "concert" setup or something very serious or Kilroy-related.
With Music Time, the guys just let go and I simply do not believe the 4 of them were not having fun doing that video. (Note: Tommy was not there and filmed his little part separately).

Bugsy

[sadie65]

sobering thought.


The "classic" styx never truly reunited after the 1984 break up. The last time all five of the classic members of styx shared the stage at the same time was over 20 years ago on the final show of the kilroy tour.....

Well how many people in general stay the same over a 20 plus year period of time? Was that necessary on a Friday afternoon?

It's the weekend. Not a time for a reality check. Just kidding.

Sadie

[Abitaman]

[quote="BlackWall"]



I agree with Abitaman, I think the future of Styx in the '80s would have been a lot like DeYoung's solo material, since he seemed to have the majority of the control, with a mix of some of what Shaw and Young did solo.. Do you guys find "Don't Wait For Heroes", "This Is The Time" and "Boomchild" as annoying as "Music Time", cause I'm pretty sure this would have been the Styx of the mid to late '80s.

quote]

I like those songs, but they were getting out of the Styx mode.
What hurt Don't Wait For Heroes as a single was the middle of the song, although is was good , the die down hurt the song. On several occasions, and on different radio stations the would start playing a new song in the middle of Heroes. The song needed to have a get down guitar solo, with Dennis ranting about not giving up over it (just my thoughts)-ERIC

[froy]

Do you guys find "Don't Wait For Heroes", "This Is The Time" and "Boomchild" as annoying as "Music Time", cause I'm pretty sure this would have been the Styx of the mid to late '80s.

Not annoying at all those are great songs

[BlackWall]

I absolutely agree about the middle of "Don't Wait For Heroes", it slows the song down so much; however, I do like when it picks back up..

It really is a decent song, some catchy pop/rock music and it features insightful lyrics, with an uplifting message, but that right there might be it's biggest setback, maybe it was a little too positive for the top 40 audience. I know there are exceptions to this, look at "Hold On", by Wilson Philips..

[bugsymalone]

I absolutely agree about the middle of "Don't Wait For Heroes", it slows the song down so much; however, I do like when it picks back up..

Gosh, that is one of my favorite parts of that song! Dennis always threw in some interesting bridges to many of his songs and I really like that one.

My biggest problem with DWFH is the fade out (Getup! Getup! Getup! etc.)

I like the bridge in "Gravity" as well.

I think the future of Styx in the '80s would have been a lot like DeYoung's solo material, since he seemed to have the majority of the control

I really don't think that would have been the case. Only my opinion, mind you. I think the input of the rest of the group would have changed the dynamics of any songs they worked on together.

I have never felt Dennis' solo work was Styx-like at all. There were/are a few songs he wrote as solo pieces (Paradise, While There's Still Time) that worked as Styx songs, but, honestly, both of those sound like solo productions to me (as did Babe, which it turns out, was, basically, a solo production).

My .02 on this.

Bugsy

[ek88]

I was reading through the liner notes of Ultimate Collection (DDY) last night and in there it states that he had a collection of songs that had Styx written all over them, but because of the current state of affairs, he tailored them for a solo album. That's probably true, but I don't think the band dynamics at the time would've allowed for much collaboration, and therefore I question how different his songs would've sounded on a Styx album. But I guess we'll never know

P.S. Ash: a sobering thought, indeed.

[ek88]

Not annoying at all those are great songs

I'm glad you enjoy them, froy. I personally think they're decent songs, and I never have any trouble enjoying Dennis' vocals. He could do polka or reggae and I'd still give it a listen and no doubt view it in a more positive light than any other artist from those genres. However, I don't think anything he's done (or will do) solo can hold a candle to those great songs he wrote with Styx. I think one thing we can all agree on here is that we can all find some DDY musical masterpieces in the Styx catalog

[BlackWall]

(Bugsy)
I really don't think that would have been the case. Only my opinion, mind you. I think the input of the rest of the group would have changed the dynamics of any songs they worked on together.

I agree with you to an extent, but by this time, Dennis had so much control.. It's true that maybe the songs would have some slightly different arrangements, but I'd be willing to bet that all of Dennis' solo singles, most likely, would have become Styx singles.