It's official DDY more successful that current Styx

[thebook]

Kilroy and Edge both sucked big time. Goofy and Mush. I enjoy Cyclorama so much more than 100 Years. It sounds like a record from a band. 100 Years sounds like DDY solo. I like band, not DDY solo. He needs to stick to what he does very well and that is ballads and broadway. He is very good at those things and not good at pretending to be a rock guy. Nothing wrong with that, just a fact.

Well, not to nitpick ... but DDY's album is a solo project.

For heaven's sake, enough with the DDY doesn't rock bullshit. He rocks about as hard as Tommy does these days. Would you call "Just Be" or Shaw Blades "rockin'" in that DY way? I sure wouldn't. And I like S/B, dislike "Just Be". Now, TS can rock on stage - no doubt, but his creative output just ain't doing it these days. The thing is, and you don't seem to get it, DDY is being DDY. He's never tried to be anyone else and I don't think he cares one way or the other what people think about it. He released the album he wanted to. Not the one you wanted. Not the one some guy in Buttfuck, Arkansas or Lickmyass, California wanted. It is what it is. If you dislike it, I don't think he's losing any sleep over it.

And read my other post - from about 1979 to 1987 TS didn't rock so hard, either. IME, he got his swagger back with Ambition and then with DY. Creatively, I would prefer he wrote with Jack more. On his own, not so good. With Jack, much better. Tommy needs a good foil I think to do his best work.

I have stated over and over..I do not go ape over any of these guys and their solo work...that includes TOMMY also. I like the band production from these guys which is why I like Cyclorama. Together as a band, throwing ideas off each other.

DDY is being DDY..nothing wrong with that and I never said there was anything wrong with that. He is what he is and I don't expect him to be anything else. Others here like to make it sound like he is the same guy from '75-78 creating some classic Styx songs with this record. Bullshit in my opinion. Nothing on 100 Years comes close to the classic Styx sound that I loved. You say he didn't release the record I wanted...what did I want? This is a solo project..why would I expect something that was impossible right now.... creating music with Tommy and JY. I am not naive enough to think DDY is going to give one shit what I or most others think and I wouldn't expect him to. Why should he?

As far as "who rocks more"... You take a few songs from Tommy to try to compare to Dennis. I look at this as a whole body of work, stage presence, attitude, etc. not just a few songs or albums in the mid-80's. Dennis was this person at one time but he changed. Nothing wrong with that at all..that's what people do..change.

Tommy does his best work with others no doubt, just as I believe Dennis is better with Tommy/JY. Tommy can do some good things with JY, but JY's best attributes are not putting songs together. Dennis and Tommy are a good writing team but other things get in the way. Tommy and Jack work great together..like brothers. Tommy and Gowan..I don't know. Gowan's two songs on Cyclo were good I thought and I could hear Tommy's presence there but do they have a good chemistry? I don't know..if they did I think more would have come from that in recent years. Maybe they have something down the pipe that is wonderful..I don't know.

"Nothing on 100 Years comes close to the classic Styx sound that I loved. " - What's your definition of the classic Styx sound? I think there are a handful of tunes that are very close to the 75-78 sound; Rain and Crossing The Rubicon are two examples. To say that these songs are not even close is simply not true. There is alot of synth work on the new album that is reminescent from the 75-78 time period. My opinion is that it is more a Stygian record than Cyclorama or for that matter Brave New World.

[Grotelul]

Kilroy and Edge both sucked big time. Goofy and Mush. I enjoy Cyclorama so much more than 100 Years. It sounds like a record from a band. 100 Years sounds like DDY solo. I like band, not DDY solo. He needs to stick to what he does very well and that is ballads and broadway. He is very good at those things and not good at pretending to be a rock guy. Nothing wrong with that, just a fact.

Well, not to nitpick ... but DDY's album is a solo project.

For heaven's sake, enough with the DDY doesn't rock bullshit. He rocks about as hard as Tommy does these days. Would you call "Just Be" or Shaw Blades "rockin'" in that DY way? I sure wouldn't. And I like S/B, dislike "Just Be". Now, TS can rock on stage - no doubt, but his creative output just ain't doing it these days. The thing is, and you don't seem to get it, DDY is being DDY. He's never tried to be anyone else and I don't think he cares one way or the other what people think about it. He released the album he wanted to. Not the one you wanted. Not the one some guy in Buttfuck, Arkansas or Lickmyass, California wanted. It is what it is. If you dislike it, I don't think he's losing any sleep over it.

And read my other post - from about 1979 to 1987 TS didn't rock so hard, either. IME, he got his swagger back with Ambition and then with DY. Creatively, I would prefer he wrote with Jack more. On his own, not so good. With Jack, much better. Tommy needs a good foil I think to do his best work.

I have stated over and over..I do not go ape over any of these guys and their solo work...that includes TOMMY also. I like the band production from these guys which is why I like Cyclorama. Together as a band, throwing ideas off each other.

DDY is being DDY..nothing wrong with that and I never said there was anything wrong with that. He is what he is and I don't expect him to be anything else. Others here like to make it sound like he is the same guy from '75-78 creating some classic Styx songs with this record. Bullshit in my opinion. Nothing on 100 Years comes close to the classic Styx sound that I loved. You say he didn't release the record I wanted...what did I want? This is a solo project..why would I expect something that was impossible right now.... creating music with Tommy and JY. I am not naive enough to think DDY is going to give one shit what I or most others think and I wouldn't expect him to. Why should he?

As far as "who rocks more"... You take a few songs from Tommy to try to compare to Dennis. I look at this as a whole body of work, stage presence, attitude, etc. not just a few songs or albums in the mid-80's. Dennis was this person at one time but he changed. Nothing wrong with that at all..that's what people do..change.

Tommy does his best work with others no doubt, just as I believe Dennis is better with Tommy/JY. Tommy can do some good things with JY, but JY's best attributes are not putting songs together. Dennis and Tommy are a good writing team but other things get in the way. Tommy and Jack work great together..like brothers. Tommy and Gowan..I don't know. Gowan's two songs on Cyclo were good I thought and I could hear Tommy's presence there but do they have a good chemistry? I don't know..if they did I think more would have come from that in recent years. Maybe they have something down the pipe that is wonderful..I don't know.

"Nothing on 100 Years comes close to the classic Styx sound that I loved. " - What's your definition of the classic Styx sound? I think there are a handful of tunes that are very close to the 75-78 sound; Rain and Crossing The Rubicon are two examples. To say that these songs are not even close is simply not true. There is alot of synth work on the new album that is reminescent from the 75-78 time period. My opinion is that it is more a Stygian record than Cyclorama or for that matter Brave New World.

Sure there are bits and pieces that have sounds from that era...Rubicon with the synth at the end but as a whole, they are written and produced in a way that do not remind me of classic Styx. Besides, it is not Dennis, Tommy and JY so how could it be? I never expected it to be. You take those songs and Styxify them...maybe you have something. As they stand, for me they don't. Some stuff on Cyclorama gave me goose bumps the first time I heard it. One With Everything, These Are The Times...even Fields of the Brave. I had none of that with 100 Years. Why can't some people just accept the fact that not everyone thinks 100 Years is all that SOME believe it is? People don't like Cyclorama...fine. It is not Dennis..for some that means a lot...fine..no problem, I understand. Reason says to expect the same the other way. I speak up when others keep ragging on current Styx with stupid, baseless crap. Just like this topic...why can't someone just say...Dennis is #1 in Quebec...leave it at that...always a stupid competition that does not involve any of us. Some people that have nothing better to do than to carouse boards and create issues.

[stabbim]

Now, I'm not saying you're blaming DDY stabbim. It just seems that most people who say Styx went soft look in one place.

Good, because I'm not.

I mean, clearly he was the chief architect of this change in direction (not only in terms of songwriting but production style as well) but it was a band situation and the band did choose to run with it. And in the larger sense, it's not really about "blame" at all. I was not a fan at the time of this shift in the band's sound, so I have no baggage attached to it. I just prefer what I prefer.

For what it's worth, Yes fans and Rush fans are just as divided as Styx fans in many ways. Many Yes fans HATE 90125 and Big Generator. To many Rush fans, anything past 1981 is shit. Some may even say after Hemispheres in 1978. That I'm familiar with since I was in a Rush tribute band. YOu have no idea how many people despise the "keyboard era" of Rush. I don't get it, but again, to each his or her own. "Tai Shan" anyone?

Ayup. And with Rush it's even more extreme because their style has changed both so often and so radically over the years. The compensating factors are that A) there are no divisive cult of personality issues to muddy the waters, because the band functions so well collectively, and B) the band has never lived & died by the single. Imagine "Tai Shan," if you will, not as a the largely forgettable filler track that it is, but as song that became a gigantic hit, winning Rush a new mainstream fanbase and creating a new signature sound for the band, necessitating that there be a "Tai Shan"-like single on every album from then on. (Yikes.)

My opinion on Yes, for what it's worth, is that 90125 is a masterpiece; possibly the best example I have ever heard of art/prog values being applied to a contemporary (at the time, anyway) pop framework. But yeah, I can see why the folks who are fans of the earlier stuff would not dig it, on multiple levels.

The bottom line is that at some point, all bands make conscious choices to go in another direction and their fans can come along or hop off the train.

True. Again, because I discovered so much of the Styx catalog retrospectively, it's easier to pick and choose what works for me without certain kinds of baggage getting in the way, and IMO there's something to appreciate on every one of their albums. I wouldn't be coming here to discuss their music on a regular basis if my interest in it just stopped dead at a certain release date. I also happily acknowledge that their stylistic shift between 79-83 gave Styx a leg up on some of their peers in a pop-culture sense. Doesn't mean that the music in question is owed my fealty, though.

Rockin' the Paradise" rocks harder than anything TS wrote for PT. Just sayin'.

Well, lest we forget, RTP is a 3-way joint composition, and considering how guitar-driven it is, I doubt that the bulk of the instrumental contribution came from DDY. Just sayin.'

[Ash]

I think this thread is really amusing. All we Dennis fans heard for YEARS was how Dennis needed to get back to his rock roots and write some new rock oriented slammin material. So thats what he does and those same people are now saying "Aw, he should have stuck to ballads and Broadway". Had he done that you'd be sitting here laughing and bitching that Dennis wasn't capable of writing anything close to rock music anymore. (of course, JY couldn't sting two phrases together with two hands and a map if his life depended on it, but I digress.) Make up your frickin minds. Dennis has released a quality album with a good balance of melodic songs. Stop trying to make him into what you think or want him to be and realize that he is who he is and if you don't like it then don't listen.

But please stop with the "Well, he needs to do this..." because the minute you get it then you change your mind.

[Barbara]

, we get songs like "Just Be".

When I first heard "Just Be", I thought it was the most beautiful song I have ever heard in a long time.

[Ash]

, we get songs like "Just Be".

When I first heard "Just Be", I thought it was the most beautiful song I have ever heard in a long time.

what was the last one? Babe?

[bugsymalone]

I think this thread is really amusing. All we Dennis fans heard for YEARS was how Dennis needed to get back to his rock roots and write some new rock oriented slammin material. So thats what he does and those same people are now saying "Aw, he should have stuck to ballads and Broadway". Had he done that you'd be sitting here laughing and bitching that Dennis wasn't capable of writing anything close to rock music anymore. (of course, JY couldn't sting two phrases together with two hands and a map if his life depended on it, but I digress.) Make up your frickin minds. Dennis has released a quality album with a good balance of melodic songs. Stop trying to make him into what you think or want him to be and realize that he is who he is and if you don't like it then don't listen.

But please stop with the "Well, he needs to do this..." because the minute you get it then you change your mind.

While there are some who seem to want Dennis to climb into a time machine and return as he was 30 years ago, he is what he is NOW And, moreover, he is what he has always been. I agree, Ash, that the album he has done is definitely quality, and sounds fantastic. If it is not going to please some fans, honestly, nothing he ever does will.


Bugsy

[Grotelul]

I think this thread is really amusing. All we Dennis fans heard for YEARS was how Dennis needed to get back to his rock roots and write some new rock oriented slammin material. So thats what he does and those same people are now saying "Aw, he should have stuck to ballads and Broadway". Had he done that you'd be sitting here laughing and bitching that Dennis wasn't capable of writing anything close to rock music anymore. (of course, JY couldn't sting two phrases together with two hands and a map if his life depended on it, but I digress.) Make up your frickin minds. Dennis has released a quality album with a good balance of melodic songs. Stop trying to make him into what you think or want him to be and realize that he is who he is and if you don't like it then don't listen.

But please stop with the "Well, he needs to do this..." because the minute you get it then you change your mind.

I have never changed my mind on this. I was never one to say Dennis should do more rock stuff as a solo artist. I always wanted him to write more rock stuff while with Styx where he had Tommy and JY to throw things off of, which he hadn't for God knows how long. He admits it himself, he is best at writing ballads. You like his new album and that's great. I'm glad you and others can get enjoyment out of it but I don't really care for it. Can you accept the fact that someone who liked Dennis' work in Styx prior to 1983 does not really care for it? Doesn't sound like it.

[Zan]

Can you accept the fact that someone who liked Dennis' work in Styx prior to 1983 does not really care for it? Doesn't sound like it.

More like, he doesn't believe it. *shrug*