MR

Does anyone know if any of Styx classic albums are going to be remastered? They sound so low in volume on my iPod compared to other albums I have. Granted I can fix this with a program I have, but still - would be nice to get them mastered to a CD level. Anyone have any info on this?

How about this.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000E0 ... F8&s=music

The Anthology was remastered.

And I thought at one time I had read that CHronicles, the 3 cd set was remastered but I can't confirm that for sure.

Ash wrote:Does anyone know if any of Styx classic albums are going to be remastered? They sound so low in volume on my iPod compared to other albums I have. Granted I can fix this with a program I have, but still - would be nice to get them mastered to a CD level. Anyone have any info on this?

No. Trust me on this. Pretty much I've had it confirmed it's not going to happen direct from a label source. I will be the first person surprised if it does happen.

And loud doesn't equal good BTW Go hang out at http://stevehoffman.tv for awhile.

styxfanNH wrote:How about this.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000E0 ... F8&s=music

The Anthology was remastered.

And I thought at one time I had read that CHronicles, the 3 cd set was remastered but I can't confirm that for sure.

Anthology, yes. So is GH and GH2, but none of the albums proper.

The 3CD set is NOT remastered. Just repackaged.

BTW, there is the BGO 2:1 import from the UK which has Equinox and CB, which states remastered by my label source said they didn't use the original masters. Sounds pretty good tho.

Ash wrote:They sound so low in volume on my iPod compared to other albums I have. Granted I can fix this with a program I have, but still - would be nice to get them mastered to a CD level. Anyone have any info on this?

Agreed on that. I just threw some stuff off of PT and Kilroy onto a minidisc with a bunch of stuff and they are really in dire need of remastering.

redSG wrote:

Ash wrote:They sound so low in volume on my iPod compared to other albums I have. Granted I can fix this with a program I have, but still - would be nice to get them mastered to a CD level. Anyone have any info on this?

Agreed on that. I just threw some stuff off of PT and Kilroy onto a minidisc with a bunch of stuff and they are really in dire need of remastering.

See, the Styx albums actually sound good. If you want "loud", do it yourself. Loud kills sound quality overall ... so be careful what you ask for. Many remasters are crispy.

The Anthology is loud, but well mastered.

styxfanNH wrote:How about this.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000E0 ... F8&s=music

The Anthology was remastered.

And I thought at one time I had read that CHronicles, the 3 cd set was remastered but I can't confirm that for sure.

Thanks, but I will take the real albums remastered, not Tommy Shaw's version of what the best Styx songs are...

What a joke that Anthology was.. who was the idiot in charge of picking out those songs? Oh wait, I just answered my own question.

StyxCollector wrote:And loud doesn't equal good BTW Go hang out at http://stevehoffman.tv for awhile.

Shhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh, I thought that was our little secret Allan

Anthology was remastered, that's all I know

SuiteMadameBlue wrote:

StyxCollector wrote:And loud doesn't equal good BTW Go hang out at http://stevehoffman.tv for awhile.

Shhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh, I thought that was our little secret Allan

Anthology was remastered, that's all I know

SSSSSSSSHHHHHHHHHHHH secret secret, I got a secret

Abitaman wrote:SSSSSSSSHHHHHHHHHHHH secret secret, I got a secret

I have a LOT of secrets!!! I'm so ready to burst on a few!!!!

SuiteMadameBlue wrote:

Abitaman wrote:SSSSSSSSHHHHHHHHHHHH secret secret, I got a secret

I have a LOT of secrets!!! I'm so ready to burst on a few!!!!

Will I have to come up to Cheesehead Land and beat it out of you? But seriously, i'm leaving Friday night to spend time up at Parker Lake up there just past Portage in a lovely little town called Oxford until the following Saturday so don't you all be like the Journey board and post non-stop


Robin

pinkfloyd1973 wrote:

Will I have to come up to Cheesehead Land and beat it out of you? But seriously, i'm leaving Friday night to spend time up at Parker Lake up there just past Portage in a lovely little town called Oxford until the following Saturday so don't you all be like the Journey board and post non-stop


Robin

Come on up here and beat it out of me!! HAH!! I hope you have September 3rd open!! We'll have fun at the concert!!

And I might be down in Bears country this weekend - LOL

I hope you have a GREAT weekend!!

StyxCollector wrote:See, the Styx albums actually sound good. If you want "loud", do it yourself. Loud kills sound quality overall ... so be careful what you ask for. Many remasters are crispy.

The Anthology is loud, but well mastered.

Of course the albums sound good...I'm simply talking about digitally remastering the albums to bring them up to a sonic level comparable to stuff being recorded today. When you put "Half-Penny, Two-Penny" next to "Kiss Your Ass Goodbye", the sound quality difference is stark. A while back, AC/DC remastered the majority of their back catalog, and it was a great enhancement to the sound. The difference between my old CD of Powerage and my new digipak one is amazing. It's louder, yes, but it's also clearer, without losing any of the original magic.

If something similar could be done to the Styx back catalog, I'd be eager to buy some of the remasters, most definitely. I'm sure there's some program out there that can equalize the songs when burning onto a disc/mp3 player, but I can't be arsed with that, to be honest.

redSG wrote:

StyxCollector wrote:See, the Styx albums actually sound good. If you want "loud", do it yourself. Loud kills sound quality overall ... so be careful what you ask for. Many remasters are crispy.

The Anthology is loud, but well mastered.

Of course the albums sound good...I'm simply talking about digitally remastering the albums to bring them up to a sonic level comparable to stuff being recorded today. When you put "Half-Penny, Two-Penny" next to "Kiss Your Ass Goodbye", the sound quality difference is stark. A while back, AC/DC remastered the majority of their back catalog, and it was a great enhancement to the sound. The difference between my old CD of Powerage and my new digipak one is amazing. It's louder, yes, but it's also clearer, without losing any of the original magic.

If something similar could be done to the Styx back catalog, I'd be eager to buy some of the remasters, most definitely. I'm sure there's some program out there that can equalize the songs when burning onto a disc/mp3 player, but I can't be arsed with that, to be honest.

Semi rant ... the discs are mastered fine. People have gotten used to things being "louder" and equate loud to good. That isn't the case. I have no less than probably 7 - 10 different versions of Paradise Theater on CD pressed in different countries from over the years. The mastering on that CD is still very, very good. Same with Kilroy. Equinox, Crystal Ball, Po8, and CITA never sounded great - loud or not.

As technology has improved, in theory, you are able to capture more of the master tape (i.e. play at, say, 88.2/24 and dither to 44.1/16), but someone can make the levels hit so close to 0 that you get digital distortion, and then EQ choices can be good or bad. The STyx stuff was recorded well to start with, so it doesn't need much.

Any louder than Anthology, and it's going to sound like crap.

Bottom line: you may like it loud, but there are many cases where loud is not good. Yes, there are programs when ripping where you can make your current CDs "louder".

The sad part is that when Ludwig remastered the songs for the Anthology, he said the master tapes were in great shape.

This is just another missed opportunity.

StyxCollector wrote:I have no less than probably 7 - 10 different versions of Paradise Theater on CD pressed in different countries from over the years. The mastering on that CD is still very, very good. Same with Kilroy. Equinox, Crystal Ball, Po8, and CITA never sounded great - loud or not.

Aha...I think what we have here is a fundamental difference of opinion about how we hear the past albums. I think stuff like PO8 sounds great. Not near as muffled sounding for some reason. I think that one and GI are the two best produced albums out of the classic Styx catalog.

StyxCollector wrote:

redSG wrote:

StyxCollector wrote:See, the Styx albums actually sound good. If you want "loud", do it yourself. Loud kills sound quality overall ... so be careful what you ask for. Many remasters are crispy.

The Anthology is loud, but well mastered.

Of course the albums sound good...I'm simply talking about digitally remastering the albums to bring them up to a sonic level comparable to stuff being recorded today. When you put "Half-Penny, Two-Penny" next to "Kiss Your Ass Goodbye", the sound quality difference is stark. A while back, AC/DC remastered the majority of their back catalog, and it was a great enhancement to the sound. The difference between my old CD of Powerage and my new digipak one is amazing. It's louder, yes, but it's also clearer, without losing any of the original magic.

If something similar could be done to the Styx back catalog, I'd be eager to buy some of the remasters, most definitely. I'm sure there's some program out there that can equalize the songs when burning onto a disc/mp3 player, but I can't be arsed with that, to be honest.

Semi rant ... the discs are mastered fine. People have gotten used to things being "louder" and equate loud to good. That isn't the case. I have no less than probably 7 - 10 different versions of Paradise Theater on CD pressed in different countries from over the years. The mastering on that CD is still very, very good. Same with Kilroy. Equinox, Crystal Ball, Po8, and CITA never sounded great - loud or not.

As technology has improved, in theory, you are able to capture more of the master tape (i.e. play at, say, 88.2/24 and dither to 44.1/16), but someone can make the levels hit so close to 0 that you get digital distortion, and then EQ choices can be good or bad. The STyx stuff was recorded well to start with, so it doesn't need much.

Any louder than Anthology, and it's going to sound like crap.

Bottom line: you may like it loud, but there are many cases where loud is not good. Yes, there are programs when ripping where you can make your current CDs "louder".

I'm with you. Most people have no idea as to the purpose of a master. Audio Sweetening and consistent volume between tracks are the two main reasons to master. Also seperate masters are done for radio so that the track will sound decent in mono and with the limiters that are the last part of a radio stations signal chain before the signal is broadcast. A loud master oftentimes means worse quality as the track is overcompressed to enable a louder track. Rip Rowan wrote a good piece on this problem:

http://www.prorec.com/prorec/articles.n ... 2E005DAF1C

The main reason to remaster an album recorded for distribution on LP is to sweeten it so it sounds decent on CD. Raising the volume to match current recordings is rarely the goal and will ruin the sound most of the time. In my opinion most of the classic era Styx albums had great masters.

Eric

redSG wrote:Aha...I think what we have here is a fundamental difference of opinion about how we hear the past albums. I think stuff like PO8 sounds great. Not near as muffled sounding for some reason. I think that one and GI are the two best produced albums out of the classic Styx catalog.

Po8 sounds great on vinyl. Crappy CD. GI sounds fine on CD. It's just those four - Po8, CB, Eqinox, and CITA I'm really unhappy with.

Mastering has nothing to do with how the original sounded. The mastering for CD on those albums suck.

Allan, when the 1st four Styx albums were released as the Wooden Nickel Era, was that remastered?

shaka wrote:The main reason to remaster an album recorded for distribution on LP is to sweeten it so it sounds decent on CD. Raising the volume to match current recordings is rarely the goal and will ruin the sound most of the time. In my opinion most of the classic era Styx albums had great masters.

All mastering is supposed to do is add that extra bit of 'sparkle', and as you say, do a bit of level matching so you're not cranking the volume up or down too much between songs. There should be dynamics.

The wrong EQ choice can kill it. If you make it too bright, it's harsh. Too much bass, ugh. Bump the mids too much? Yuck.

The problem with most CDs is that every bit sounds like it is at 0dB. Even if your max is 0dB, there should be dynamics, and it should sound musical, not digital. It's very easy to take something supremely listenable and make it unlistenable with the crank of a knob.

Jodes wrote:Allan, when the 1st four Styx albums were released as the Wooden Nickel Era, was that remastered?

Jodes it was remastered according to the booklet in the cd. Both The Wooden Nickel Recordings and the Anthology were mastered at Gateway Mastering in Portland Maine.

Thanks Allan, I don't have that Wooden Nickel CD with me right now (it's in Mayerthorpe) I thought it was remastered, but I wasn't sure.

Thanks for the info!

Bob Ludwig did the WN and the Anthology.

Ironically, the WN years have been remastered a few times (original Best of Styx on RCA; reissued Best of STyx, Styx II, MOM, and SIR in 1990/1991 - 2x - Japanese and US versions; the Japanese only remasters from 2001 of SIR, MOM, and Styx II, and teh Japanese only Best of; and then the WN collection; Styx I has been done 2x - the One Way and WN).

The A&M years other than hits collections? Nada.

StyxCollector wrote:Po8 sounds great on vinyl. Crappy CD. GI sounds fine on CD. It's just those four - Po8, CB, Eqinox, and CITA I'm really unhappy with.

Mastering has nothing to do with how the original sounded. The mastering for CD on those albums suck.

I think the majority of the back catalog sounds great on vinyl. It's just that, with PT and Kilroy in particular, something was lost in the transfer to CD...for me, anyways. It's not strictly a loudness issue, but more of a clarity one. And this isn't a Styx-only problem...a lot of my collection is like that. Alice Cooper's Special Forces has an abysmal sound quality on CD.