MR

Sorry but someone had to say it.

DarwinNebraska wrote:Sorry but someone had to say it.

Your right
NO BS here we know I have blasted these guys since day one but its now a joke.
From multi platinum cds to a 40 min opening act all just to spite 1 guy i mean really how ridiculous
Gee guys you really showed Dennis didnt you.
They once had there own jet plane to fly from gig to gig now they hitch hike
Nothing to be proud of if you are a STYX fan
STYX has been ruined just like JRNY crash and burn.

Multiple reasons why you would want to, primarily to play before larger crowds, and introduce your music to a different set of fans. The goal being is that when you launch your tour for next summer, a new crowd will show up.

The alternatives for most classic rock bands are to co-headline with other classic rock bands in a medium size venue, headline small venues, or play state fairs. They each have advantages and disadvantages. But, such is the life of many aging former rock stars. Other than the a select few bands who reunite for mega concerts on rare occassion and command top dollar and fill stadiums, the rest are relegated to the options above.

blt man wrote:Multiple reasons why you would want to, primarily to play before larger crowds, and introduce your music to a different set of fans. The goal being is that when you launch your tour for next summer, a new crowd will show up.

Bingo. I think this is great for both Styx and Foreigner. And if they keep getting reviews like they did last night in Cincinnati, the results will be there in no time. They're playing in 20,000 seat venues all summer (granted, they probably perform to 10,000-12,000, but still). How else would they get that exposure?

You don't think on some level it pains JY or TS to be opening for DL when Styx had major success before DL had with Pyromania? As everyone else says, it's exposure. They didn't open for Deep Purple just to do it. It gets them in front of 10 - 20,000 instead of 2,000. Do the math. Even if you only get 10 - 20% of the bigger audience interested in you, it means a better chance of a sellout or bigger venue the next time you come through on your own. This isn't rocket science. It's business, and while some may think it's pathetic for bands like Styx to open for someone else, face the facts: it's 2007, not 1977 or even 1987. On their own, these bands play the 2000 seaters. Opening for others or banding together allows them to play bigger venues.

There are a few exceptions to this, one of which is Rush. I saw them last night and they were great. I've seen them every tour since 1987, and this was one of the best times even with some set list issues (IMO). The current Styx or DDY show doesn't hold a candle to the Rush show, nor do I expect them to.

fightingilliniJRNY wrote:

blt man wrote:Multiple reasons why you would want to, primarily to play before larger crowds, and introduce your music to a different set of fans. The goal being is that when you launch your tour for next summer, a new crowd will show up.

Bingo. I think this is great for both Styx and Foreigner. And if they keep getting reviews like they did last night in Cincinnati, the results will be there in no time. They're playing in 20,000 seat venues all summer (granted, they probably perform to 10,000-12,000, but still). How else would they get that exposure?

Except if you keep touring without a break for 7 years, there is only so many people (even new people) you will draw. Would it be so bad to take some time off, record new material, rest voices and then come back with a stronger tour? Do they each need the money so badly that they need to constantly tour?

blt man wrote:

fightingilliniJRNY wrote:

blt man wrote:Multiple reasons why you would want to, primarily to play before larger crowds, and introduce your music to a different set of fans. The goal being is that when you launch your tour for next summer, a new crowd will show up.

Bingo. I think this is great for both Styx and Foreigner. And if they keep getting reviews like they did last night in Cincinnati, the results will be there in no time. They're playing in 20,000 seat venues all summer (granted, they probably perform to 10,000-12,000, but still). How else would they get that exposure?

Except if you keep touring without a break for 7 years, there is only so many people (even new people) you will draw. Would it be so bad to take some time off, record new material, rest voices and then come back with a stronger tour? Do they each need the money so badly that they need to constantly tour?

Probably not, they take time off. Just not years or seasons. THey will be taking much of November and December off. They clearly like bein gon stage and touring or they wouldn't be.

StyxCollector wrote:There are a few exceptions to this, one of which is Rush. I saw them last night and they were great. I've seen them every tour since 1987, and this was one of the best times even with some set list issues (IMO). The current Styx or DDY show doesn't hold a candle to the Rush show, nor do I expect them to.

1) Rush never really "broke up" like most classic rock bands

2) They still have all key players

3) Not only that, but Rush is one of those few bands where ALL members are considered EQUAL. I don't think they would draw near the crowds if any of the three "retired" and were "replaced".

4) Rush was never a "hits" band - they only had one top 40 song (and it <I>wasn't</> Tom Sawyer - that peaked at 46) Therefore, they built their <B>reputation</B> being a live band that put on one helluva show.

I'm sorry you don't like the set list they're playing - I love it, but I can see why some may not.

Take care!
Cinj

StyxCollector wrote:There are a few exceptions to this, one of which is Rush. I saw them last night and they were great. I've seen them every tour since 1987, and this was one of the best times even with some set list issues (IMO). The current Styx or DDY show doesn't hold a candle to the Rush show, nor do I expect them to.

1) Rush never really "broke up" like most classic rock bands

2) They still have all key players

3) Not only that, but Rush is one of those few bands where ALL members are considered EQUAL. I don't think they would draw near the crowds if any of the three "retired" and were "replaced".

4) Rush was never a "hits" band - they only had one top 40 song (and it <I>wasn't<I/> Tom Sawyer - that peaked at 46) Therefore, they built their <B>reputation</B> being a live band that put on one helluva show.

I'm sorry you don't like the set list they're playing - I love it, but I can see why some may not.

Take care!
Cinj

From what i have heard STYX & FOREIGNER are going to be alternating as to who goes one first while on tour this summer with DEF LEPPARD. So you may want to check your local concert venue for set times

cinj wrote:

StyxCollector wrote:There are a few exceptions to this, one of which is Rush. I saw them last night and they were great. I've seen them every tour since 1987, and this was one of the best times even with some set list issues (IMO). The current Styx or DDY show doesn't hold a candle to the Rush show, nor do I expect them to.

1) Rush never really "broke up" like most classic rock bands

2) They still have all key players

3) Not only that, but Rush is one of those few bands where ALL members are considered EQUAL. I don't think they would draw near the crowds if any of the three "retired" and were "replaced".

True, true, and true. Would that more bands could learn from their example.

cinj wrote:
4) Rush was never a "hits" band - they only had one top 40 song (and it <i>wasn't</i> Tom Sawyer - that peaked at 46) Therefore, they built their <B>reputation</B> being a live band that put on one helluva show.

Absolutely right. They didn't live (or die) by the single. That, and many of the qualities which were condemned as their biggest weaknesses back in the day have now become their greatest strengths.

cinj wrote:I'm sorry you don't like the set list they're playing - I love it, but I can see why some may not.

With one or two nitpicky exceptions, I think it's bloody fantastic. It's exactly the sort of thing that Styx should be doing (or rather, should have started doing back when BNW came out -- bit late now.)

Wait a minute.... Styx is going on *before* Foreigner?!? A Foreigner that's even less legit than this version of Styx?

That's even sadder than I thought.

Funny how the unwashed masses have no clue that between these two bands there are like maybe 3 people that were actually a part of recording the music they're hearing.

Sad... truly sad.

StyxCollector wrote:You don't think on some level it pains JY or TS to be opening for DL when Styx had major success before DL had with Pyromania? As everyone else says, it's exposure. They didn't open for Deep Purple just to do it. It gets them in front of 10 - 20,000 instead of 2,000

.

Im sorry but you are wrong
18 thousand are parking there cars and tailgating and 2000 are watching the opening act
I have never sat through an opening act
Sorry 1 time STYX BTO in 75 and STYX blew them off the stage.
Styx is playing for money not exposure
Sorry to say,

Fact Finder wrote:Last nights timeline in Cincy.

Styx 7:00-7:50

An absolute farse

Fact Finder wrote:Does anyone really know what a tour package like this pays an opening act?

$50,000 a night? $35,000? ???

After expenses, what amount would a JY or TS actually receive?

Just curious.

15 tops split 5 ways

Tommy will be jumping this 'boat on the river' and doing more with Jack or join up with Dennis and Glen.
The only descent person left in this band who doesn't need the $$$$$ as bad as the rest will be the first to leave...again.
One orignal member left, who will be left.
Tommy is too gifted, and getting much older, to be left in this shit mix.
Sadly, the ages that our childhood/teen years acts are, and the ages we are now, they will all be done anyway before we are done.
This band is becoming a frickin' cover/opening act and will be for sure once Tommy leaves.

Froy, I talked to people at the show, and they said that the venue was about 3/4 full when Styx hit the stage...

froy wrote:

DarwinNebraska wrote:Sorry but someone had to say it.

Your right
NO BS here we know I have blasted these guys since day one but its now a joke.
From multi platinum cds to a 40 min opening act all just to spite 1 guy i mean really how ridiculous
Gee guys you really showed Dennis didnt you.
They once had there own jet plane to fly from gig to gig now they hitch hike
Nothing to be proud of if you are a STYX fan
STYX has been ruined just like JRNY crash and burn.

First off...7:00-7:50 is 50 min and not 40. I am a current Styx fan and like their show and new recordings much better than what DDY has produced. I am not alone and they are gaining more and more fans by playing in front of larger crowds. What does Dennis play? 20 shows a year? Styx is playing to more people in 2 nights this summer than DDY will be playing to all year. You go listen to your here DDY and keep thinking his new CD is great. It will soon be forgotten by most.

Grotelul, it only matters if in that 50 minutes they can turn that around and get others to either a) buy their music or b) show up the next time they play in the area. So while it's exposure, it's a huge gamble.

Dennis last year I think played most weekends, plus private/corporate gigs. I'd say he does 40 - 50 dates per year if not more. The flip side is STyx, who as a fan of both sides, overexposed themselves over the past 7 years and can do with a bit of playing less. When at any given point I could have seen them 3 - 4 times in my immediate area in the course of a year, it's too much.

There's a balance. Dennis is happy playing less. Styx wants to play more, but it's part of the reason they've landed where they are sooner than they most likely needed to.

Grotelul wrote:First off...7:00-7:50 is 50 min and not 40. I am a current Styx fan and like their show and new recordings much better than what DDY has produced. I am not alone and they are gaining more and more fans by playing in front of larger crowds. What does Dennis play? 20 shows a year?

The numbers would speak otherwise... their status continues to slip as the years go by. They've been touring non-stop for 9 years... and what has it got them... opener on a 3-band bill?!?

Dennis isn't touring as "Styx" so to compare his attendance figures as so isn't really accurate. However, I wouldn't doubt if Dennis had toured with a band of musicians and called it Styx for the last 8 years, that they'd be doing better than opening band while people are still drinking out in the parking lot.

Tommy and JY have treated the band as nothing more than a cash cow. In the process they've watered it down so much... that a Styx show is no longer "special". It's like a cheap whore who'll get into bed with anyone.

This band was headlining summer sheds in '96 & '97... now they're opening for tribute bands (see Foreigner).

I thought the past 8 years were *building the band up*... in reality they're driving it into the ground.

What's next.. Bar Mitzvahs?

Grotelul wrote:You go listen to your here DDY and keep thinking his new CD is great. It will soon be forgotten by most.

First it will have to actually be heard by most, and that ain't gonna happen.

Sorry to keep beating the same drum as Allan, but he's absolutely right -- these guys are all in more or less the same boat commercially (along with the vast majority of their contemporaries) and no amount of "my favorite band member can beat up your favorite band member" nonsense is gonna change it.

DarwinNebraska wrote:Funny how the unwashed masses have no clue that between these two bands there are like maybe 3 people that were actually a part of recording the music they're hearing.

Sad... truly sad.

Yeah, I hate having to suffer through "Lady" and "Suite Madame Blue" without John Curelewski.

It pales, man. It pales.

stabbim wrote:

DarwinNebraska wrote:Funny how the unwashed masses have no clue that between these two bands there are like maybe 3 people that were actually a part of recording the music they're hearing.

Sad... truly sad.

Yeah, I hate having to suffer through "Lady" and "Suite Madame Blue" without John Curelewski.

It pales, man. It pales.

I was talking Foreigner *and* Styx, goofy.

Jodes wrote:Froy, I talked to people at the show, and they said that the venue was about 3/4 full when Styx hit the stage...

If you say so

DarwinNebraska wrote:

Grotelul wrote:First off...7:00-7:50 is 50 min and not 40. I am a current Styx fan and like their show and new recordings much better than what DDY has produced. I am not alone and they are gaining more and more fans by playing in front of larger crowds. What does Dennis play? 20 shows a year?

The numbers would speak otherwise... their status continues to slip as the years go by. They've been touring non-stop for 9 years... and what has it got them... opener on a 3-band bill?!?

Dennis isn't touring as "Styx" so to compare his attendance figures as so isn't really accurate. However, I wouldn't doubt if Dennis had toured with a band of musicians and called it Styx for the last 8 years, that they'd be doing better than opening band while people are still drinking out in the parking lot.

Tommy and JY have treated the band as nothing more than a cash cow. In the process they've watered it down so much... that a Styx show is no longer "special". It's like a cheap whore who'll get into bed with anyone.

This band was headlining summer sheds in '96 & '97... now they're opening for tribute bands (see Foreigner).

I thought the past 8 years were *building the band up*... in reality they're driving it into the ground.

What's next.. Bar Mitzvahs?

He aint heavy
He's my Brother

Nailed it man'

stabbim wrote:

Grotelul wrote:You go listen to your here DDY and keep thinking his new CD is great. It will soon be forgotten by most.

First it will have to actually be heard by most, and that ain't gonna happen.

Sorry to keep beating the same drum as Allan, but he's absolutely right -- these guys are all in more or less the same boat commercially (along with the vast majority of their contemporaries) and no amount of "my favorite band member can beat up your favorite band member" nonsense is gonna change it.

True but someone has to play counterpart to Froy's crazed posts so sometimes I have be as nutty to keep up. Not always though, usually only in response to craziness.

DarwinNebraska wrote:

stabbim wrote:

DarwinNebraska wrote:Funny how the unwashed masses have no clue that between these two bands there are like maybe 3 people that were actually a part of recording the music they're hearing.

Sad... truly sad.

Yeah, I hate having to suffer through "Lady" and "Suite Madame Blue" without John Curelewski.

It pales, man. It pales.

I was talking Foreigner *and* Styx, goofy.

Not really my point, but Ok.

stabbim wrote:

Grotelul wrote:You go listen to your here DDY and keep thinking his new CD is great. It will soon be forgotten by most.

First it will have to actually be heard by most, and that ain't gonna happen.

Sorry to keep beating the same drum as Allan, but he's absolutely right -- these guys are all in more or less the same boat commercially (along with the vast majority of their contemporaries) and no amount of "my favorite band member can beat up your favorite band member" nonsense is gonna change it.

I can see it now: MTV revives Celebrity Deathmatch. DDY vs. JY, no holes barred.

I get bashed for supporting both sides of the fence (and am ironically shunned by each camp by being denied things like interviews because of it). In 1999 the Tommy/JY/Styx vs. DDY debate was really cute, but anyone expecting a "Santana-like" or "Aerosmith-like" comeback for either is sadly mistaken.

DDY has gotten really lucky that Canada has embraced him post-1999 and that he's still selling records up there. His new album is great, but is radio in the US going to really play "Rubicon" in 2007? No.

Styx could counter with a good album in 2008 - same fate. Again, they got lucky that some radio stations in some areas embraced "I Am the Walrus".

It's sad, but that's the reality of nearly every one of the bands we grew up with. It could be worse, though - we could be discussing Journey who has finally realized that recording new music is pointless and wants to cash in on the whole "nostalgia sound".

I like Styx but this isnt the original band. And this version of Foreigner is a real joke.

There are 2 reasons that Styx are the opening band for Def Leppard, and not the other way around. 1) Def Leppard has kept its current line up for years, and except for the death of Steve Clark is close to the original band. 2) Styx was good, but never anywhere as mass popular as Def Leppard, not even close.

I saw Journey last year, but it wasnt the same without Steve Perry. I hope Styx sounds good, and Im sure they will, but I am getting tired of these bands with a couple of original members trying to pass themselves off as the original band. And dont even get me started on Foreigner....................

wmscottmc wrote:I hope Styx sounds good, and Im sure they will, but I am getting tired of these bands with a couple of original members trying to pass themselves off as the original band.

Please to be explaining how, aside from use of a name, the band is "trying to pass themselves off" as anything other than who they are. Like the lineup or don't, but this idea of equating member changes to perpetrating a fraud is just silly.