Cornerstone Turning 30

[Everett]

With the new year quickly approching 2009 marks the 30th anniversary of the cornerstone album. One would think or hope that they would do something from this album to acknowledge
this milestone. The least they could do is put boat on the river in the full time set. Any thoughts?

[froy]

With the new year quickly approching 2009 marks the 30th anniversary of the cornerstone album. One would think or hope that they would do something from this album to acknowledge
this milestone. The least they could do is put boat on the river in the full time set. Any thoughts?

You would need the real STYX band back first before you could do anythng to celebrate it.

[Toph]

With the new year quickly approching 2009 marks the 30th anniversary of the cornerstone album. One would think or hope that they would do something from this album to acknowledge
this milestone. The least they could do is put boat on the river in the full time set. Any thoughts?

Actually, we are still a year out from the Cornerstone release - it was released in late 1979..

30 years ago Pieces of Eight was just rocketing up the charts. Renegade hadn't even been released yet!

[LordofDaRing]

JY and TS will include First Time in the set.

[classicstyxfan]

I wont be celebrating anything to do with Cornerstone...........it was the beginning of the end from my point of view.

[ChicagoSTYX]

I would call it "How to kill a rock band by DDY" all you need to do is put First Time, Babe, and Why Me in the middle of Equinox then listen to it all the way through and you'll see what I mean. YES no......NO yes :roll:

[chowhall]

I would call it "How to kill a rock band by DDY" all you need to do is put First Time, Babe, and Why Me in the middle of Equinox then listen to it all the way through and you'll see what I mean. YES no......NO yes :roll:

I don't know, I always kinda liked Why Me. I'm with you on the other two.

[froy]

I would call it "How to kill a rock band by DDY" all you need to do is put First Time, Babe, and Why Me in the middle of Equinox then listen to it all the way through and you'll see what I mean. YES no......NO yes :roll:

I don't know, I always kinda liked Why Me. I'm with you on the other two.

Why me was killer
I saw it live
They brought out a sax player during the solo.
Great tour Lights, Why Me, Im Ok, Great White Hope all live.

[froy]

I would call it "How to kill a rock band by DDY" all you need to do is put First Time, Babe, and Why Me in the middle of Equinox then listen to it all the way through and you'll see what I mean. YES no......NO yes :roll:

Or put Jennifer, Father OSA and This Old Man on Cornerstone and it makes it a awesome record.
First Time is lame I will give ya that
Prima Volta...

[AnnieOprah]

I would call it "How to kill a rock band by DDY" all you need to do is put First Time, Babe, and Why Me in the middle of Equinox then listen to it all the way through and you'll see what I mean. YES no......NO yes :roll:

Interesting in that Cornerstone was the only STYX album to ever get nominated for a Grammy. It was huge in its day. Went all the way to #2 - their 2nd highest charting album ever. Babe their only #1 single. It was a brilliant move by DDY - even if you can't see it through your rose colored glasses.

[chowhall]

I would call it "How to kill a rock band by DDY" all you need to do is put First Time, Babe, and Why Me in the middle of Equinox then listen to it all the way through and you'll see what I mean. YES no......NO yes :roll:

Interesting in that Cornerstone was the only STYX album to ever get nominated for a Grammy. It was huge in its day. Went all the way to #2 - their 2nd highest charting album ever. Babe their only #1 single. It was a brilliant move by DDY - even if you can't see it through your rose colored glasses.

Brilliant is hardly a word that anyone has used to describe Babe. It got him fired from the band for the first time(funny how that came up), splintered the fan base, and started much of the critical bashing that Styx has endured. As far as Babe as a song goes, it sounds like a song that Murph and MagicTones should be singing.

[MCM]

I wont be celebrating anything to do with Cornerstone...........it was the beginning of the end from my point of view.

Although I love Cornerstone, I agree.. it was the beginning of the end. I think that I love that album so much due to the time period in my life when I spent so much time with it, not so much the music itself. In retrospect I don't like it as much as Equinox or Pieces of Eight, but at the time I wore out at least one or two copies of it.

[froy]

Brilliant is hardly a word that anyone has used to describe Babe. It got him fired from the band for the first time

Could you imagine every song writer getting fired after writing a number 1 hit?
Don't forget after Conerstone was Paradise where the money rolled in.

[BlackWall]

"Cornerstone" is not one my favorite albums, but "Paradise Theatre" is a masterpiece, and wouldn't have happened had DDY not changed the style up with "Cornerstone". It's too bad that they had to go with the "Kilroy" concept for the release right after "PT".. Don't get me wrong; personally, I kinda enjoy several of the tracks from "Kilroy", but what it did to the band.. They were riding so high with "PT", and they had reached a point that they could still rock and have commercial pop success, and then "Kilroy".. "Cornerstone" was too slick and too light on the rockers; "Borrowed Time" just sounded too forced to me, but with songs like "Snowblind" and "Half Penny-Two Penny", and to a certain extent, even "Too Much Time On My Hands", "Paradise Theatre" accurately represented that the band could do both.

[chowhall]

Brilliant is hardly a word that anyone has used to describe Babe. It got him fired from the band for the first time

Could you imagine every song writer getting fired after writing a number 1 hit?
Don't forget after Conerstone was Paradise where the money rolled in.

I don't disagree that it brought in a lot of money for all members of the band. I'm not disputing Dennis' brilliance, I just don't think Babe is close to his best work. I love PT which is the last time any cooperation existed in the band. I guess the question is "are millions of dollars worth raiding Barry Manilow's closet?"

[bugsymalone]

While I am no fan of "Babe" and especially not of "The First Time", I find Cornerstone a really enjoyable album. One of their most melodic ever. And it did set the stage for Styx becoming a top level band with their next album.

I have always wondered, though, what would have happened if Dennis had stayed fired, so-to-speak, and moved on as a solo artist. What would have become of the band? What would Dennis have done musically as a solo artist? In 1979/1980.

Styx: Drop the keyboards and become a guitar-based hard rock band?

Dennis: A "Desert Moon" with "The Best of Times" as the album's centerpiece?

No Kilroy concept album ever?

I always wonder.


Bugsy

[yogi]

To me it seems like all the really good bands change directions and get more melodic.

REO, Journey, Foreigner, Metalica, GNR , AC/DC (has) today Sevendust, Staind..........


They evolve and want the radio friendly hits.

[Toph]

Brilliant is hardly a word that anyone has used to describe Babe. It got him fired from the band for the first time

Could you imagine every song writer getting fired after writing a number 1 hit?
Don't forget after Conerstone was Paradise where the money rolled in.

It's funny how things are reacted to in hindsight. And yes, hindsight is 20-20. But at the time, you can't argue with the fact that Cornerstone achieved the goal of making them more mainstream and a bigger, more popular band - Cornerstone was their highest charting album to date (#2), Babe hit #1, they won the People's Choice Award, were nominated for a grammy, and were voted the most popular group in America by a Gallup Poll. Were these good things for the band? Well, its debatable. But if they had put out Act 3 of basically the same album as GI or PO8, they would have no doubt not been as successful and not as mainstream either. The only place for them to go at that point was slowly down (ala Kansas or Blue Oyster Cult). Instead, they kept the ship afloat for 4 more years and also churned out their most successful album sales/chart-wise in Paradise Theatre.

[LordofDaRing]

"I would call it "How to kill a rock band by DDY" all you need to do is put First Time, Babe, and Why Me in the middle of Equinox then listen to it all the way through and you'll see what I mean. YES no......NO yes"

Are we not talking apples and oranges here? You could put Boat on the River on Equinox and get the same results IMO. In fact, this might be a stretch, but I am not sure Love in the Midnight or Lights would have worked on Equinox or Grand Illusion for that matter.

[Toph]

"I would call it "How to kill a rock band by DDY" all you need to do is put First Time, Babe, and Why Me in the middle of Equinox then listen to it all the way through and you'll see what I mean. YES no......NO yes"

Are we not talking apples and oranges here? You could put Boat on the River on Equinox and get the same results IMO. In fact, this might be a stretch, but I am not sure Love in the Midnight or Lights would have worked on Equinox or Grand Illusion for that matter.

Certainly "Never Say Never" wouldn't have worked...but for some reason Tommy always seems to get a pass...

[StyxCollector]

Tommy gets a big pass. Quite frankly, none of his songs quite "rocked" on Cornerstone, either. He didn't rock all the time going back to Crystal Ball. The only rocker on Cornerstone is "Eddie" and I really don't like that song. It was very clear that the band did not write together for that album, and it's lack of cojones has as much to do with JY and TS as it does with DDY.

[StyxCollector]

I can't edit my post, wanted to add this:
I see Cornerstone as the bridge album. Without it - even with DDY in the band - they would have died a quick death in the 80s had they stayed on the GI or Po8 path. Like it or not, it was a necessary evil to jump from big act to mega huge, much like Journey wouldn't be the Journey we all know today without Perry if they had stayed on the track of the first three albums.

[greaper_ca]

I'd have to agree with "Why Me". One of my favs from that album. Also Borrowed Time.

"Don't look now but here come the 80's". Man...that phrase makes me feel old!

Here we are in 2008.

Who could recollect what has happened between now and 1979?

Berlin Wall
3 wars or make that 4. (Bosnian, 1st Iraq, 2nd Iraq, Afghanistan)
1st black President.

[greaper_ca]

I can't edit my post, wanted to add this:
I see Cornerstone as the bridge album. Without it - even with DDY in the band - they would have died a quick death in the 80s had they stayed on the GI or Po8 path. Like it or not, it was a necessary evil to jump from big act to mega huge, much like Journey wouldn't be the Journey we all know today without Perry if they had stayed on the track of the first three albums.

I don't know..you really think so? Bon Jovi wasn't a late 70/80's act but followed the same path in the 80's in my opinion and look where they are today. There was a time when I thought that Areosmith were dead, then back in the 90's for some reason came back.

[LordofDaRing]

I think as the story goes, the entire band sat down at the beginning of the recording of this album and discussed the direction. I think they felt that the art rock or whatever you want to refer to it as, was dying a fast death as the 80s was beginning. I think of the cornerstone album as a few old songs that might have been floating around in somebody's head that just did not fit in on POE and GI. I still like it, I think it flows along as a collection, maybe individualy there are no Renedgades or Come Sail Aways, but I still pull it out and listen to it on occasion. It takes me back to a happy care free time in High School and Keg parties, where it received a lot of air play.

[StyxCollector]

I can't edit my post, wanted to add this:
I see Cornerstone as the bridge album. Without it - even with DDY in the band - they would have died a quick death in the 80s had they stayed on the GI or Po8 path. Like it or not, it was a necessary evil to jump from big act to mega huge, much like Journey wouldn't be the Journey we all know today without Perry if they had stayed on the track of the first three albums.

I don't know..you really think so? Bon Jovi wasn't a late 70/80's act but followed the same path in the 80's in my opinion and look where they are today. There was a time when I thought that Areosmith were dead, then back in the 90's for some reason came back.

Would I have posted it if I didn't believe it? Your timeframe is off on Aerosmith. Aerosmith's comeback started in 1987 after they got clean and sober, not in the 90s, but they sold new product consistently well until the mid-90s (i.e. through Get A Grip). Once they went back to Columbia starting with Nine Lives, it's been downhill for Aerosmith. So they had a good 7 - 8 year run of a renaissance. I'd say the Aerosmith thing was more of a fluke than anything else and it helped they had hot chicks in the videos It was good timing. Also, it didn't hurt that the whole rap/rock thing with Run DMC helped kick that comeback off.

Bon Jovi wrote pop songs from day one ("Runaway" anyone?), they were far from heavy IMO. They're basically the only survivors of the hair/glam metal era who still sell and enjoy huge popularity. Again, a fluke. There's always one in a bunch. It also helps that a large amount of women find Jon attractive and to some degree Richie, and growing up in the MTV era helped them a lot. Styx has always been pretty much a faceless band. I doubt most people outside of fans could pick out most members of Styx past or present in the mall if they were walking around.

AC/DC I'd lump in the fluke category as well. Look at the success of their new one in the USA with it only being a Walmart exclusive. It's sold as much or more than the Journey and it is only a single disc - not a new album + hits redone + DVD. U2 is another survivor who still sells tons of each album.

[chowhall]

AC/DC I'd lump in the fluke category as well. Look at the success of their new one in the USA with it only being a Walmart exclusive. It's sold as much or more than the Journey and it is only a single disc - not a new album + hits redone + DVD. U2 is another survivor who still sells tons of each album.

AC/DC has put out the same album for what 35 years now. If Dennis had another CSA or Tommy Renegade in them, who knows how long Styx could have milked commercial success. GI and POE weren't chart toppers and seminal music for the masses like Back in Black was, so they'd have had to have a #1 album to make it work. However, given the personal dynamics within the band, it most likely would have ended up the same way.

[cinj]

I can't edit my post, wanted to add this:
I see Cornerstone as the bridge album. Without it - even with DDY in the band - they would have died a quick death in the 80s had they stayed on the GI or Po8 path. Like it or not, it was a necessary evil to jump from big act to mega huge, much like Journey wouldn't be the Journey we all know today without Perry if they had stayed on the track of the first three albums.

Thank you, Allan! It really surprises me how many people don't "get" this. Even some of the current band members seem oblivious to this point.

The way I see it, you can lump bands into 3 categories:
1) One hit wonders - One hit song, then they disappear forever
2) The band's that "last" forever. Either literally, like the Stones, or in memory, like the Beatles.
3) Band's that have a couple of good albums, are well loved, but then refuse to do anything new and then disappear (Men at Work comes to mind...I might also put Survivor in that category)

I think the Cornerstone album rescued Styx from being a number 3 and allowed them to be a number 2. Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying they're in the same league as the Stones or the Beatles - but probably 90% of us wouldn't be here posting had the band not branched out.

For the record (pardon the pun), I don't like Cornerstone nearly as much as Pieces of Eight or Grand Illusion, but then again, I like Tommy Shaw's What If album. So what do I know?

Cinj

[StyxCollector]

AC/DC has put out the same album for what 35 years now. If Dennis had another CSA or Tommy Renegade in them, who knows how long Styx could have milked commercial success. GI and POE weren't chart toppers and seminal music for the masses like Back in Black was, so they'd have had to have a #1 album to make it work. However, given the personal dynamics within the band, it most likely would have ended up the same way.

Put this in perspective: CSA hit #8 and Renegade #16. Hits no doubt, but not top 5. CSA along with Lady (6), Babe(1), The Best of Times (3), TMTOMH(9), Mr. Roboto (3),and Don't Let It End (6) cracked the top 10. Music was changing so a career or CSA or Renegade, I'm not so sure. AC/DC is an odd bird that way. But remember that AC/DC hasn't sold a new album with the sales they're seeing of the new one in a long time. Their back catalog sells well to this day, and yes, their albums are very similar (lol). I mean, Back in Black has sold nearly as many albums as Styx has in total. 'nuff said there.

[StyxCollector]

Grrr ... career OF ... can't edit post.