MR

I'm reading your book for the second time...

I'm curious, what was the reaction to the charges from some in your book that Dennis had mental problems?
Those seem like pretty hefty charges and I'd think that there'd be some kind of problem printing that stuff. Maybe because it's someone's quote, it's okay... but did you hear about that stuff from the DeYoung camp?

brywool wrote:I'm reading your book for the second time...

I'm curious, what was the reaction to the charges from some in your book that Dennis had mental problems?
Those seem like pretty hefty charges and I'd think that there'd be some kind of problem printing that stuff. Maybe because it's someone's quote, it's okay... but did you hear about that stuff from the DeYoung camp?

I think that they may be referring to DDY's "mental breakdowns" he was having when he missed being around his family while on tour. I think that even DDY has admitted having some issues in past interviews. I am right Sterling?

well his "breakdowns" were mentioned on national tv on behind the music so I dont think it is that big of a secret or issue.

nah, they weren't talking about that. In the book, "schizophrenia" was mentioned among other things...

brywool wrote:I'm reading your book for the second time...

I'm curious, what was the reaction to the charges from some in your book that Dennis had mental problems?
Those seem like pretty hefty charges and I'd think that there'd be some kind of problem printing that stuff. Maybe because it's someone's quote, it's okay... but did you hear about that stuff from the DeYoung camp?

You know what, I felt that I had to get into that to a small degree because I had so much of it from so many different people. All I can say is I sourced that very carefully to make sure that I had it on the record from multiple people who had known him at different times over a period of time and all had the same take on it. You can't really tell the story of his interaction with the band without getting into that.

Nobody from the DeYoung camp ever said anything about that part of the book to me.

Other than that, I can only say that nobody in that camp spoke to me "on the record". Look, it's no secret that Dennis has depression problems, and he himself has said time and time again that he had a breakdown. And read his interviews, over and over and over he'll say, "I was pretty depressed when I wrote this or that song . . ." and so on.

Depression is a mental illness caused by an imbalance of chemicals in the brain. It is a real illness, not a character flaw. NO mental illness is a character defect. So there should be no defensiveness about it and there should be no stigma about it. And for what it's worth, the vast majority of very highly gifted creative people have some form of mental illness. The VAST majority. It's kind of the elephant in the room that everyone in the music business knows is true, but nobody talks about in public much.


By the way, same deal with Tommy, and it's not a huge secret either.

Sterling

good take on it. Both have had their problems, and both seem to be ok about the past.

Sterling, I've said it before long ago, but it should be said again, the book was/is great and it's so cool to have you around to answer questions.

I know you've mentioned some possible new book projects in the past ... anything coming to fruition yet?

FYI-
I'm not knocking the book or the claims or mental illness. Trust me, I know all about it. I've had family members who had huge problems with bipolar issues.
A nervous breakdown is MUCH different than saying "I was depressed when I wrote this song". Having "Mental Problems" (a quote) is also much different than saying the guy had a nervous breakdown.

Just wondered. Wasn't slagging you at all guy.

Rockwriter wrote:
Depression is a mental illness caused by an imbalance of chemicals in the brain. It is a real illness, not a character flaw. NO mental illness is a character defect. So there should be no defensiveness about it and there should be no stigma about it. And for what it's worth, the vast majority of very highly gifted creative people have some form of mental illness. The VAST majority. It's kind of the elephant in the room that everyone in the music business knows is true, but nobody talks about in public much.

Amen to every word there Sterling.

brywool wrote:FYI-
I'm not knocking the book or the claims or mental illness. Trust me, I know all about it. I've had family members who had huge problems with bipolar issues.
A nervous breakdown is MUCH different than saying "I was depressed when I wrote this song". Having "Mental Problems" (a quote) is also much different than saying the guy had a nervous breakdown.

Just wondered. Wasn't slagging you at all guy.

Oh no, I didn't think you were giving me a hard time. I just wanted to make very clear that I don't think anyone should be made to feel judged or belittled because of an illness . . . so I hope nobody in the DeYoung camp saw it that way. Now, whether the people who made those observations in the book felt that way, I can't say.

I often liken musical ability - or artistic ability of any kind - to the movie 'A Beautiful Mind'. A big gift on the one hand, and a big burden on the other at times. Perhaps it's nature's way of balancing people out. I always find it interesting.

Thanks, I hope all is well.

Sterling

Andrew wrote:

Rockwriter wrote:
Depression is a mental illness caused by an imbalance of chemicals in the brain. It is a real illness, not a character flaw. NO mental illness is a character defect. So there should be no defensiveness about it and there should be no stigma about it. And for what it's worth, the vast majority of very highly gifted creative people have some form of mental illness. The VAST majority. It's kind of the elephant in the room that everyone in the music business knows is true, but nobody talks about in public much.

Amen to every word there Sterling.

You've had a ringside seat to it as well! It really is interesting to meet and interact with stars in a less controlled environment and see what they can really be like, as opposed to what a fan might believe they would be like. Quite eye-opening at times.


Sterling

Another observation from your book Sterling:

In reading the book again, and I remember this from my first time through it, I'm a bit let down by a lot of Glen's statements. It's like "he's just too cool" for Styx and he really disses each member of the band several times in the book (with the possible exception of John). I guess that was his experience and on one hand, it's good to know that stuff. However, the guy just doesn't appear to be proud or grateful of anything that he and the band did which is a shame. I think Glen's contributions to Styx were some of their best moments and to hear that he regards himself as a footnote to the band's history, and to see him really make an effort to try and elevate himself above the band was sad. I've got most of Glen's stuff and unless I'm mistaken, he had no bigger gig than when he was with Styx. I'd think that'd be something he'd be more proud of. Not to diss Glen. I love Glen and his music, but it was just sad to read that he didn't seem to enjoy much of it.

brywool wrote:Another observation from your book Sterling:

In reading the book again, and I remember this from my first time through it, I'm a bit let down by a lot of Glen's statements. It's like "he's just too cool" for Styx and he really disses each member of the band several times in the book (with the possible exception of John). I guess that was his experience and on one hand, it's good to know that stuff. However, the guy just doesn't appear to be proud or grateful of anything that he and the band did which is a shame. I think Glen's contributions to Styx were some of their best moments and to hear that he regards himself as a footnote to the band's history, and to see him really make an effort to try and elevate himself above the band was sad. I've got most of Glen's stuff and unless I'm mistaken, he had no bigger gig than when he was with Styx. I'd think that'd be something he'd be more proud of. Not to diss Glen. I love Glen and his music, but it was just sad to read that he didn't seem to enjoy much of it.

I think you are reading Glen all wrong. He talks down everything he has ever done. I have met and spoken to him at length many times and he talks his work down everytime. The only time he talks positively is about another performer doing one of his songs. It is just his nature.

It can be infuriating when you are a fan and admire a guy's talent to have him not just not accept a compliment, but actually reject it with force. Even on his web page, when asked about past release and possible reissues of out of print items he always states that it would be a waste of time because nobody wants any of that music including himself.

Note to Burtnik:



Knock that stuff off!

brywool wrote:Another observation from your book Sterling:

In reading the book again, and I remember this from my first time through it, I'm a bit let down by a lot of Glen's statements. It's like "he's just too cool" for Styx and he really disses each member of the band several times in the book (with the possible exception of John). I guess that was his experience and on one hand, it's good to know that stuff. However, the guy just doesn't appear to be proud or grateful of anything that he and the band did which is a shame. I think Glen's contributions to Styx were some of their best moments and to hear that he regards himself as a footnote to the band's history, and to see him really make an effort to try and elevate himself above the band was sad. I've got most of Glen's stuff and unless I'm mistaken, he had no bigger gig than when he was with Styx. I'd think that'd be something he'd be more proud of. Not to diss Glen. I love Glen and his music, but it was just sad to read that he didn't seem to enjoy much of it.

I agree with the other point made, that Glen tends to point out his weaknesses. But I also agree with you; I don't think Glen really likes Styx, or ever did when it comes down to it. I think he sees his time in Styx as a compromise for money, not something he wanted to do. I also think he thinks to himself, 'If only I hadn't joined that band, could I have had the solo career I really wanted?'

Glen is very, very talented, and a nice guy. He has been an asset to Styx in both eras, and to Dennis as well. But for his own sake, I sincerely hope that Glen Burtnik will never accept money to play Styx songs ever again in his life, because I don't think it brings him any joy to do so. And that kinda sucks.



Sterling

Rockwriter wrote:Glen is very, very talented, and a nice guy. He has been an asset to Styx in both eras, and to Dennis as well. But for his own sake, I sincerely hope that Glen Burtnik will never accept money to play Styx songs ever again in his life, because I don't think it brings him any joy to do so. And that kinda sucks.

I liken it to guys that play in cover bands.

Sure, ya gotta play those songs that you hate but audiences love if you want to get work. I mean, does an audience in a bar REALLY need to hear "Sweet Home Alabama" or "Shook Me All Night Long" at EVERY gig?? Pretty much. It's just a fact. In a way, it's a bit of 'whoring yourself out'. You can liken this to Styx with Dennis too. I'm sure Dennis says "Ya gotta play Babe and Roboto because the audience loves it." while JY and Tommy rolled their eyes...

However, you can either be "Mr. Prima Donna Musician" who won't dare lower himself to play some songs people WANT to hear... OR you say "You know what? I'm also an ENTERTAINER and that also gets me off, so I will compromise my musical integrity to entertain". I found Glen SUPER entertaining on all the Styx tours and I saw the Edge tour too. (I have black and white photos of that somewhere, I'll have to dig them out). He had a ton of energy, he sang and played his a$$ off (upside down bass, how can you not dig that!?- not just lefty, but Dick Dale-style upside down!) and it just bums me out that he really wasn't just digging the hell out of that gig. Oh well... I guess I kind of feel sorry for him. The guy's a major friggin' talent both in Styx and out of it, though I must say, I prefer him WITH Styx. (Sorry kids- and Glen!)

How can you not get off on playing huge shows for an audience that is really in your corner? I don't get that mentality at all.

The other thing that boggles my mind is Styx under utilizing him. With all respect to JY, Glen should've had more tracks on the last Styx album than JY did. He's a better singer and better writer. Both his Cyclo songs were album highlights.

It seems to me that if his albums don't sell, and they don't, then it seems that to have your songs released on an album or by a band that sells more than you do alone is a good thing that you'd want to support.

He obviously has his reason for not being in the band.

brywool wrote:

Rockwriter wrote:Glen is very, very talented, and a nice guy. He has been an asset to Styx in both eras, and to Dennis as well. But for his own sake, I sincerely hope that Glen Burtnik will never accept money to play Styx songs ever again in his life, because I don't think it brings him any joy to do so. And that kinda sucks.

I liken it to guys that play in cover bands.

Sure, ya gotta play those songs that you hate but audiences love if you want to get work. I mean, does an audience in a bar REALLY need to hear "Sweet Home Alabama" or "Shook Me All Night Long" at EVERY gig?? Pretty much. It's just a fact. In a way, it's a bit of 'whoring yourself out'. You can liken this to Styx with Dennis too. I'm sure Dennis says "Ya gotta play Babe and Roboto because the audience loves it." while JY and Tommy rolled their eyes...

However, you can either be "Mr. Prima Donna Musician" who won't dare lower himself to play some songs people WANT to hear... OR you say "You know what? I'm also an ENTERTAINER and that also gets me off, so I will compromise my musical integrity to entertain". I found Glen SUPER entertaining on all the Styx tours and I saw the Edge tour too. (I have black and white photos of that somewhere, I'll have to dig them out). He had a ton of energy, he sang and played his a$$ off (upside down bass, how can you not dig that!?- not just lefty, but Dick Dale-style upside down!) and it just bums me out that he really wasn't just digging the hell out of that gig. Oh well... I guess I kind of feel sorry for him. The guy's a major friggin' talent both in Styx and out of it, though I must say, I prefer him WITH Styx. (Sorry kids- and Glen!)

How can you not get off on playing huge shows for an audience that is really in your corner? I don't get that mentality at all.

The other thing that boggles my mind is Styx under utilizing him. With all respect to JY, Glen should've had more tracks on the last Styx album than JY did. He's a better singer and better writer. Both his Cyclo songs were album highlights.

It seems to me that if his albums don't sell, and they don't, then it seems that to have your songs released on an album or by a band that sells more than you do alone is a good thing that you'd want to support.

He obviously has his reason for not being in the band.

I think he enjoyed the shows themselves. Just not the music, if that makes any sense. But yeah, after a while it gets old, playing music you don't like and meanwhile, it takes you away from other things you could be doing, like writing songs for other artists.

Styx utilized him to the extent they thought they could. So much of what he writes is not a match for the band. And frankly, one of the problems with CYCLO and his contributions was that he was holding back many of his best songs for WTH. I mean, a song like "Bam" could've been on there, but he kept it aside. So it's not all their fault.

The reality is Styx fans expect a certain amount of Tommy, and a certain amount of JY, and most fans truly don't care if Glen is there or not. I don't mean that to be ugly, it's true, and Glen knows it's true, which may be part of his problem with the situation. It's a big, big ego adjustment going from your own solo act to being fourth fiddle in a band you don't even like all that much. I'm sure that's a difficult thing. It would be for anyone with that much to offer.


Sterling

Rockwriter wrote:
The reality is Styx fans expect a certain amount of Tommy, and a certain amount of JY, and most fans truly don't care if Glen is there or not...

"most" Styx fans are dumb then.

To elevate a song like "Mr. Roboto" to top ten status and to ignore songs such as "Killing the Thing That You Love" or "Love is the Ritual" or "All in a Day's Work" shows you how dumb people can be. Maybe now I get where Glen's coming from.

brywool wrote:

Rockwriter wrote:
The reality is Styx fans expect a certain amount of Tommy, and a certain amount of JY, and most fans truly don't care if Glen is there or not...

"most" Styx fans are dumb then.

To elevate a song like "Mr. Roboto" to top ten status and to ignore songs such as "Killing the Thing That You Love" or "Love is the Ritual" or "All in a Day's Work" shows you how dumb people can be. Maybe now I get where Glen's coming from.

Well, it just comes down to one person's taste vs. another's. The relative merit of a piece of music (or ANY art) is in the perception of the person experiencing it. With Styx, long, long before Glen came along there was a paradigm established for what people expect Styx to sound like; a paradigm that had nothing to do with him, his voice, his writing or his tastes. He came along and wrote some great stuff, almost all of which was far outside of that paradigm. Not surprisingly, existing fans didn't embrace a lot of that, and Styx was already too old to earn that many new fans by then.

It's like going to work at McDonald's and suddenly saying, "Fuck this, I'm sick of these same old burgers, I'm gonna start serving tacos now," and of course people would probably react adversely to that because they are expecting the same old Big Mac they've been ordering every day since childhood. It's really no different. Once you put a price tag on music, it's just another consumer product. If you don't like that, do something else for a living and play in a band on the weekends, you know? Then you can play exactly what you want.

That said, of course it's frustrating. It's that way for everyone, not just Glen. Once you've had a certain level of success, you are going to be trapped by your own past forever. In Glen's case he was going to remain trapped by someone ELSE'S past forever, as long as he chose to remain in that situation.


Sterling

Rockwriter wrote:

brywool wrote:

Rockwriter wrote:
The reality is Styx fans expect a certain amount of Tommy, and a certain amount of JY, and most fans truly don't care if Glen is there or not...

"most" Styx fans are dumb then.

To elevate a song like "Mr. Roboto" to top ten status and to ignore songs such as "Killing the Thing That You Love" or "Love is the Ritual" or "All in a Day's Work" shows you how dumb people can be. Maybe now I get where Glen's coming from.

Well, it just comes down to one person's taste vs. another's. The relative merit of a piece of music (or ANY art) is in the perception of the person experiencing it. With Styx, long, long before Glen came along there was a paradigm established for what people expect Styx to sound like; a paradigm that had nothing to do with him, his voice, his writing or his tastes. He came along and wrote some great stuff, almost all of which was far outside of that paradigm. Not surprisingly, existing fans didn't embrace a lot of that, and Styx was already too old to earn that many new fans by then.

It's like going to work at McDonald's and suddenly saying, "Fuck this, I'm sick of these same old burgers, I'm gonna start serving tacos now," and of course people would probably react adversely to that because they are expecting the same old Big Mac they've been ordering every day since childhood. It's really no different. Once you put a price tag on music, it's just another consumer product. If you don't like that, do something else for a living and play in a band on the weekends, you know? Then you can play exactly what you want.



That said, of course it's frustrating. It's that way for everyone, not just Glen. Once you've had a certain level of success, you are going to be trapped by your own past forever. In Glen's case he was going to remain trapped by someone ELSE'S past forever, as long as he chose to remain in that situation.


Sterling

Sorry to take over the topic with this...
See, to me ALL of Glen's contributions to Edge were MUCH more STYX sounding than Mr. Roboto or most of that album was to me. Even Ritual. It may have had a funk vibe, but it was heavy guitars and harmonies (ala Renegade, Born for Adventure, etc.). Kilroy was all synths and was like NOTHING the band had done before.

Rockwriter wrote:That said, of course it's frustrating. It's that way for everyone, not just Glen. Once you've had a certain level of success, you are going to be trapped by your own past forever. In Glen's case he was going to remain trapped by someone ELSE'S past forever, as long as he chose to remain in that situation.

That's it in a nutshell I guess. It's interesting to me how some bands can make the jump from their past into the future and others just can't. U2 is a good example of that. Aerosmith was a good example of that, but now I'm not sure what's up with them. Maybe that's what Dennis was trying to accomplish with Cornerstone, but for my money, it didn't work.

Another obvious point is that with Glen there were too many cooks in the kitchen. Glen had some killer contributions to "Cyclo", but he was originally in Styx as Tommy's replacement: he sounds too much like Tommy. Tommy, J.Y., Larry, and then Glen; that's a lot of voices for one group- especially when two of them sound so much like the other. He was never going to get too many songs per album for this reason. Now, how much did he hold back his material vs. how much did the guys not utilize him? We don't know. I do think his departure was a loss for the band, though. He's a great performer and songwriter. It's too bad they couldn't have kept him around for the material, but I'm sure he wouldn't have been happy giving the bulk of his songs to Tommy or someone else to sing.

[quote="BlackWall"]Another obvious point is that with Glen there were too many cooks in the kitchen. Glen had some killer contributions to "Cyclo", but he was originally in Styx as Tommy's replacement: he sounds too much like Tommy. Tommy, J.Y., Larry, and then Glen; that's a lot of voices for one group- especially when two of them sound so much like the other. He was never going to get too many songs per album for this reason. Now, how much did he hold back his material vs. how much did the guys not utilize him? We don't know. I do think his departure was a loss for the band, though. He's a great performer and songwriter. It's too bad they couldn't have kept him around for the material, but I'm sure he wouldn't have been happy giving the bulk of his songs to Tommy or someone else to sing.[/quote]

I'm sure he still would if they asked. It would be a source of income for Glen and he would provide excellent material for Styx. He could even produce it to have an outsider's point of view.

BlackWall wrote:Another obvious point is that with Glen there were too many cooks in the kitchen. Glen had some killer contributions to "Cyclo", but he was originally in Styx as Tommy's replacement: he sounds too much like Tommy. Tommy, J.Y., Larry, and then Glen; that's a lot of voices for one group- especially when two of them sound so much like the other. He was never going to get too many songs per album for this reason. Now, how much did he hold back his material vs. how much did the guys not utilize him? We don't know. I do think his departure was a loss for the band, though. He's a great performer and songwriter. It's too bad they couldn't have kept him around for the material, but I'm sure he wouldn't have been happy giving the bulk of his songs to Tommy or someone else to sing.

I think after the split in '99 TS and JY missed an opportunity with Glen. If they were looking to really "change the direction" of Styx and present "a new better version" they could have utilized Glen's talents in many ways. But, I think the reality is TS and JY looked at it as "now it's our turn" and the focus needs to be on us. It's a shame. When Glen joined Styx in '90 I enjoyed his contributions to the band just as much as the original members. I thought the guy made a excellent choice in adding Glen to the mix. I also think DDY feels that way as well.

Boomchild wrote:

BlackWall wrote:Another obvious point is that with Glen there were too many cooks in the kitchen. Glen had some killer contributions to "Cyclo", but he was originally in Styx as Tommy's replacement: he sounds too much like Tommy. Tommy, J.Y., Larry, and then Glen; that's a lot of voices for one group- especially when two of them sound so much like the other. He was never going to get too many songs per album for this reason. Now, how much did he hold back his material vs. how much did the guys not utilize him? We don't know. I do think his departure was a loss for the band, though. He's a great performer and songwriter. It's too bad they couldn't have kept him around for the material, but I'm sure he wouldn't have been happy giving the bulk of his songs to Tommy or someone else to sing.

I think after the split in '99 TS and JY missed an opportunity with Glen. If they were looking to really "change the direction" of Styx and present "a new better version" they could have utilized Glen's talents in many ways. But, I think the reality is TS and JY looked at it as "now it's our turn" and the focus needs to be on us. It's a shame. When Glen joined Styx in '90 I enjoyed his contributions to the band just as much as the original members. I thought the guy made a excellent choice in adding Glen to the mix. I also think DDY feels that way as well.

Oh, please that is just so wrong. Even Glen said that, like it or not, Tommy had become the voice of Styx and it had become clear that any potential singles were going to be with Tommy's voice. So, it didn't matter how good a song like "Kiss Your Ass Goodbye" was, it would never be released as a single because it did not have Tommy's lead vocal. This is not a *STYX* decision, it's a label decision.

These guys have to appease the record label, not the other way around. So, Glen's usefulness was limited and I think that's a huge reason why he left...combined with the fact that they were touring so much and never recording. I'd love to read Zan's comments on this, too.

But, as for your latest conspiracy theory of "now it's our turn...", IMO, it's just pure BS.

Monker wrote:

Boomchild wrote:

BlackWall wrote:Another obvious point is that with Glen there were too many cooks in the kitchen. Glen had some killer contributions to "Cyclo", but he was originally in Styx as Tommy's replacement: he sounds too much like Tommy. Tommy, J.Y., Larry, and then Glen; that's a lot of voices for one group- especially when two of them sound so much like the other. He was never going to get too many songs per album for this reason. Now, how much did he hold back his material vs. how much did the guys not utilize him? We don't know. I do think his departure was a loss for the band, though. He's a great performer and songwriter. It's too bad they couldn't have kept him around for the material, but I'm sure he wouldn't have been happy giving the bulk of his songs to Tommy or someone else to sing.

I think after the split in '99 TS and JY missed an opportunity with Glen. If they were looking to really "change the direction" of Styx and present "a new better version" they could have utilized Glen's talents in many ways. But, I think the reality is TS and JY looked at it as "now it's our turn" and the focus needs to be on us. It's a shame. When Glen joined Styx in '90 I enjoyed his contributions to the band just as much as the original members. I thought the guy made a excellent choice in adding Glen to the mix. I also think DDY feels that way as well.

Oh, please that is just so wrong. Even Glen said that, like it or not, Tommy had become the voice of Styx and it had become clear that any potential singles were going to be with Tommy's voice. So, it didn't matter how good a song like "Kiss Your Ass Goodbye" was, it would never be released as a single because it did not have Tommy's lead vocal. This is not a *STYX* decision, it's a label decision.

These guys have to appease the record label, not the other way around. So, Glen's usefulness was limited and I think that's a huge reason why he left...combined with the fact that they were touring so much and never recording. I'd love to read Zan's comments on this, too.

But, as for your latest conspiracy theory of "now it's our turn...", IMO, it's just pure BS.

not recording? he left the year cyclo came out

Born4adventure wrote:

Monker wrote:

Boomchild wrote:

BlackWall wrote:Another obvious point is that with Glen there were too many cooks in the kitchen. Glen had some killer contributions to "Cyclo", but he was originally in Styx as Tommy's replacement: he sounds too much like Tommy. Tommy, J.Y., Larry, and then Glen; that's a lot of voices for one group- especially when two of them sound so much like the other. He was never going to get too many songs per album for this reason. Now, how much did he hold back his material vs. how much did the guys not utilize him? We don't know. I do think his departure was a loss for the band, though. He's a great performer and songwriter. It's too bad they couldn't have kept him around for the material, but I'm sure he wouldn't have been happy giving the bulk of his songs to Tommy or someone else to sing.

I think after the split in '99 TS and JY missed an opportunity with Glen. If they were looking to really "change the direction" of Styx and present "a new better version" they could have utilized Glen's talents in many ways. But, I think the reality is TS and JY looked at it as "now it's our turn" and the focus needs to be on us. It's a shame. When Glen joined Styx in '90 I enjoyed his contributions to the band just as much as the original members. I thought the guy made a excellent choice in adding Glen to the mix. I also think DDY feels that way as well.

Oh, please that is just so wrong. Even Glen said that, like it or not, Tommy had become the voice of Styx and it had become clear that any potential singles were going to be with Tommy's voice. So, it didn't matter how good a song like "Kiss Your Ass Goodbye" was, it would never be released as a single because it did not have Tommy's lead vocal. This is not a *STYX* decision, it's a label decision.

These guys have to appease the record label, not the other way around. So, Glen's usefulness was limited and I think that's a huge reason why he left...combined with the fact that they were touring so much and never recording. I'd love to read Zan's comments on this, too.

But, as for your latest conspiracy theory of "now it's our turn...", IMO, it's just pure BS.

not recording? he left the year cyclo came out

Thanks! did not know this.He was good in the band i thought.

Boomchild wrote:I think after the split in '99 TS and JY missed an opportunity with Glen. If they were looking to really "change the direction" of Styx and present "a new better version" they could have utilized Glen's talents in many ways. But, I think the reality is TS and JY looked at it as "now it's our turn" and the focus needs to be on us. It's a shame. When Glen joined Styx in '90 I enjoyed his contributions to the band just as much as the original members. I thought the guy made a excellent choice in adding Glen to the mix. I also think DDY feels that way as well.

Monker wrote:Oh, please that is just so wrong. Even Glen said that, like it or not, Tommy had become the voice of Styx and it had become clear that any potential singles were going to be with Tommy's voice. So, it didn't matter how good a song like "Kiss Your Ass Goodbye" was, it would never be released as a single because it did not have Tommy's lead vocal. This is not a *STYX* decision, it's a label decision.

These guys have to appease the record label, not the other way around. So, Glen's usefulness was limited and I think that's a huge reason why he left...combined with the fact that they were touring so much and never recording. I'd love to read Zan's comments on this, too.

But, as for your latest conspiracy theory of "now it's our turn...", IMO, it's just pure BS.

As I said in my response, they could have used Glen's talents in MANY ways. I didn't say that they should have put Glen totally out in front or that "Kiss Your Ass Goodbye" should have been the main single released from the "Giant Carrot Album". They could have used him for writing a song that TS would sing lead, have him more involved in what to go with as a single or involved with production. In this particular case I think you are putting label influence higher then it actually was. Also IMO, if you think that the egos of all three of them (TS, DDY, JY) had nothing to do with control over the band your dead wrong.