MR

Have they ever played this one live?

Joe From Buffalo wrote:Have they ever played this one live?

I hope not. Not a great song.

Joe From Buffalo wrote:Have they ever played this one live?

Probably during the original tour. I think gowan could nail that one.

Ash wrote:

Joe From Buffalo wrote:Have they ever played this one live?

I hope not. Not a great song.

What? One of dennis's last great rockin tunes. That trade off between tommy and
the sax player is freakin killer.

Speaking of this album does anyone have audio of this
tour they could share?

Joe From Buffalo wrote:Have they ever played this one live?

One of my favs off Cornerstone. It also was one of the first Styx 45's I bought.

I think it's an excellent song with a great verse melody. I also really love the sound of DDY's Fender Rhodes. His use of it on the entire record really shines.

Annoying song like most of the Dennis lead vocals.

I like the planet p project version more.

Yes they played it live on the Cornerstone tour and I believe they had the sax solo too.

Everett wrote:

Ash wrote:

Joe From Buffalo wrote:Have they ever played this one live?

I hope not. Not a great song.

What? One of dennis's last great rockin tunes. That trade off between tommy and
the sax player is freakin killer.

That's actually JY playing opposite Steve Eisen. One of my favorite solos of his - he's really outside of his usual box on that one. Great phrasing.


Sterling

Rockwriter wrote:

Everett wrote:

Ash wrote:

Joe From Buffalo wrote:Have they ever played this one live?

I hope not. Not a great song.

What? One of dennis's last great rockin tunes. That trade off between tommy and
the sax player is freakin killer.

That's actually JY playing opposite Steve Eisen. One of my favorite solos of his - he's really outside of his usual box on that one. Great phrasing.


Sterling

Really JY? Well thanks for the clarification sterling.

Joe From Buffalo wrote:Have they ever played this one live?

Was never supposed to be a single - became an emergency single after the "First Time" incident. I would have selected Lights or BT over it.

Everett wrote:Speaking of this album does anyone have audio of this
tour they could share?

yeah recorded from England, sound wise I have not been able to clean it up much. Sounds like from a 2oth generation tape.

love this song

Toph wrote:

Joe From Buffalo wrote:Have they ever played this one live?

Was never supposed to be a single - became an emergency single after the "First Time" incident. I would have selected Lights or BT over it.

Question for Sterling (or anyone else who might know) -

Why was this song selected as the First Time replacement? To my ear, Lights is much catchier and, in the spirit of Foolin Yourself or Sing For The Day (both were singles) could have had better success on the charts than Why Me. Was this considered at all as a single?

Toph wrote:

Toph wrote:

Joe From Buffalo wrote:Have they ever played this one live?

Was never supposed to be a single - became an emergency single after the "First Time" incident. I would have selected Lights or BT over it.

Question for Sterling (or anyone else who might know) -

Why was this song selected as the First Time replacement? To my ear, Lights is much catchier and, in the spirit of Foolin Yourself or Sing For The Day (both were singles) could have had better success on the charts than Why Me. Was this considered at all as a single?

Because Madonna..I mean Dennis pulled the Diva card.

gr8whitehope wrote:

Toph wrote:

Toph wrote:

Joe From Buffalo wrote:Have they ever played this one live?

Was never supposed to be a single - became an emergency single after the "First Time" incident. I would have selected Lights or BT over it.

Question for Sterling (or anyone else who might know) -

Why was this song selected as the First Time replacement? To my ear, Lights is much catchier and, in the spirit of Foolin Yourself or Sing For The Day (both were singles) could have had better success on the charts than Why Me. Was this considered at all as a single?

Because Madonna..I mean Dennis pulled the Diva card.

Actually, it was the record company's choice, along with every single release from that era. Dennis had no ability to dictate singles. It was not Dennis' choice to release "First Time," either, it was theirs, in response to radio stations requesting a single on it. When Tommy said no to that, A&M went with 'Why Me,' probably hoping to continue the crossover pop success they'd had with "Babe." Dennis at that point was the only member who'd had crossover radio success, so it only makes sense they'd try to chase that and go with him and the voice that had just sang a #1 Top 40 hit, and 'Why Me' is really the only song left on the album of his that might have played well at Top 40 radio. Dennis has even said that he disagreed with the single choice of 'Why Me' because he thought it wasn't a hit single, just an album track in his opinion.

I don't know about "Lights," but as with anything a record company does, you can bet it was probably determined by some kind of market research.

Sterling

gr8whitehope wrote:

Toph wrote:

Toph wrote:

Joe From Buffalo wrote:Have they ever played this one live?

Was never supposed to be a single - became an emergency single after the "First Time" incident. I would have selected Lights or BT over it.

Question for Sterling (or anyone else who might know) -

Why was this song selected as the First Time replacement? To my ear, Lights is much catchier and, in the spirit of Foolin Yourself or Sing For The Day (both were singles) could have had better success on the charts than Why Me. Was this considered at all as a single?

Because Madonna..I mean Dennis pulled the Diva card.

Don't you look stupid now.

Rockwriter wrote:

gr8whitehope wrote:

Toph wrote:

Toph wrote:

Joe From Buffalo wrote:Have they ever played this one live?

Was never supposed to be a single - became an emergency single after the "First Time" incident. I would have selected Lights or BT over it.

Question for Sterling (or anyone else who might know) -

Why was this song selected as the First Time replacement? To my ear, Lights is much catchier and, in the spirit of Foolin Yourself or Sing For The Day (both were singles) could have had better success on the charts than Why Me. Was this considered at all as a single?

Because Madonna..I mean Dennis pulled the Diva card.

Actually, it was the record company's choice, along with every single release from that era. Dennis had no ability to dictate singles. It was not Dennis' choice to release "First Time," either, it was theirs, in response to radio stations requesting a single on it. When Tommy said no to that, A&M went with 'Why Me,' probably hoping to continue the crossover pop success they'd had with "Babe." Dennis at that point was the only member who'd had crossover radio success, so it only makes sense they'd try to chase that and go with him and the voice that had just sang a #1 Top 40 hit, and 'Why Me' is really the only song left on the album of his that might have played well at Top 40 radio. Dennis has even said that he disagreed with the single choice of 'Why Me' because he thought it wasn't a hit single, just an album track in his opinion.

I don't know about "Lights," but as with anything a record company does, you can bet it was probably determined by some kind of market research.

Sterling

LOL....I remember getting in an argument over this very topic. The bottom line is that the label releases the album and singles, not the band.

The only question I would have is how could Tommy, or any other member, could veto a single release? I mean, if a member can't say, "I want this song as a single..." How can a member say, "Do not release that song as a single"

Monker wrote:

Rockwriter wrote:

gr8whitehope wrote:

Toph wrote:

Toph wrote:

Joe From Buffalo wrote:Have they ever played this one live?

Was never supposed to be a single - became an emergency single after the "First Time" incident. I would have selected Lights or BT over it.

Question for Sterling (or anyone else who might know) -

Why was this song selected as the First Time replacement? To my ear, Lights is much catchier and, in the spirit of Foolin Yourself or Sing For The Day (both were singles) could have had better success on the charts than Why Me. Was this considered at all as a single?

Because Madonna..I mean Dennis pulled the Diva card.

Actually, it was the record company's choice, along with every single release from that era. Dennis had no ability to dictate singles. It was not Dennis' choice to release "First Time," either, it was theirs, in response to radio stations requesting a single on it. When Tommy said no to that, A&M went with 'Why Me,' probably hoping to continue the crossover pop success they'd had with "Babe." Dennis at that point was the only member who'd had crossover radio success, so it only makes sense they'd try to chase that and go with him and the voice that had just sang a #1 Top 40 hit, and 'Why Me' is really the only song left on the album of his that might have played well at Top 40 radio. Dennis has even said that he disagreed with the single choice of 'Why Me' because he thought it wasn't a hit single, just an album track in his opinion.

I don't know about "Lights," but as with anything a record company does, you can bet it was probably determined by some kind of market research.

Sterling

LOL....I remember getting in an argument over this very topic. The bottom line is that the label releases the album and singles, not the band.

The only question I would have is how could Tommy, or any other member, could veto a single release? I mean, if a member can't say, "I want this song as a single..." How can a member say, "Do not release that song as a single"

Wasn't this one of the many times Tommy threatened to quit if First Time was released as a single? If so, my guess is that is why they backed off.

Baron Von Bielski wrote:

gr8whitehope wrote:

Toph wrote:

Toph wrote:

Joe From Buffalo wrote:Have they ever played this one live?

Was never supposed to be a single - became an emergency single after the "First Time" incident. I would have selected Lights or BT over it.

Question for Sterling (or anyone else who might know) -

Why was this song selected as the First Time replacement? To my ear, Lights is much catchier and, in the spirit of Foolin Yourself or Sing For The Day (both were singles) could have had better success on the charts than Why Me. Was this considered at all as a single?

Because Madonna..I mean Dennis pulled the Diva card.

Don't you look stupid now.

It's not the first and most likely not the last.

Boomchild wrote:

Baron Von Bielski wrote:

gr8whitehope wrote:

Toph wrote:

Toph wrote:

Joe From Buffalo wrote:Have they ever played this one live?

Was never supposed to be a single - became an emergency single after the "First Time" incident. I would have selected Lights or BT over it.

Question for Sterling (or anyone else who might know) -

Why was this song selected as the First Time replacement? To my ear, Lights is much catchier and, in the spirit of Foolin Yourself or Sing For The Day (both were singles) could have had better success on the charts than Why Me. Was this considered at all as a single?

Because Madonna..I mean Dennis pulled the Diva card.

Don't you look stupid now.

It's not the first and most likely not the last.

I'm right about everything all the time.

You guys are hilarious.
When things go Dennis' way,Sterling and his book and knowledge is gold.

But when things go against Dennis,Sterling and his book and knowledge don't cut it.
He wasn't there,the right people weren't asked,so and so was on on pay rolls,
holes and flaws,only one side of the story.

But then again,maybe Sterling was in the office where the suits picked 'Why me'.
Though I think he was probably out playing tag or go hide and seek.

Rockwriter wrote:

gr8whitehope wrote:

Toph wrote:

Toph wrote:

Joe From Buffalo wrote:Have they ever played this one live?

Was never supposed to be a single - became an emergency single after the "First Time" incident. I would have selected Lights or BT over it.

Question for Sterling (or anyone else who might know) -

Why was this song selected as the First Time replacement? To my ear, Lights is much catchier and, in the spirit of Foolin Yourself or Sing For The Day (both were singles) could have had better success on the charts than Why Me. Was this considered at all as a single?

Because Madonna..I mean Dennis pulled the Diva card.

Actually, it was the record company's choice, along with every single release from that era. Dennis had no ability to dictate singles. It was not Dennis' choice to release "First Time," either, it was theirs, in response to radio stations requesting a single on it. When Tommy said no to that, A&M went with 'Why Me,' probably hoping to continue the crossover pop success they'd had with "Babe." Dennis at that point was the only member who'd had crossover radio success, so it only makes sense they'd try to chase that and go with him and the voice that had just sang a #1 Top 40 hit, and 'Why Me' is really the only song left on the album of his that might have played well at Top 40 radio. Dennis has even said that he disagreed with the single choice of 'Why Me' because he thought it wasn't a hit single, just an album track in his opinion.

I don't know about "Lights," but as with anything a record company does, you can bet it was probably determined by some kind of market research.

Sterling

Would this be the same crack marketing research team that chose as Love As The Ritual as the lead singer off Edge?

Let's face it, Styx was a stellar band, but many times, the folks at A&M and their marketing research team, tended to not pick the best songs for singles.

By 1990 Styx had control over which single was released. They picked Ritual over the record company's choice of Show Me The Way.

'Ritual is a better song than Show Me The Way if you ask me. I thought Love Is The Ritual was a fantastic song. Different, but very cool.

Show me the Way is a great song, don't get me wrong... and Dennis (I believe) said they did LITR first to showcase Glen as the new addition.

gr8dane wrote:You guys are hilarious.
When things go Dennis' way,Sterling and his book and knowledge is gold.

But when things go against Dennis,Sterling and his book and knowledge don't cut it.
He wasn't there,the right people weren't asked,so and so was on on pay rolls,
holes and flaws,only one side of the story.

But then again,maybe Sterling was in the office where the suits picked 'Why me'.
Though I think he was probably out playing tag or go hide and seek.

I never thought of Sterling's book as the totally full and accurate details on Styx history. This is no offense to Sterling either. I think he did a great job of pulling together the information that was "out there". I haven't praised his book in the direction of any of the "camps". The point is that none of the major players (i.e DDY, TS, JY) were interviewed directly for the book and the secondary players (i.e. Glen, Tood) came late to the party and were not around for the drama and all the stuff of the past. Not to mention that none of the major players has put their seal of approval on the book. I have wondered if any of them has read it and ever commented on what they thought of it.

Monker wrote:

Rockwriter wrote:

gr8whitehope wrote:

Toph wrote:

Toph wrote:

Joe From Buffalo wrote:Have they ever played this one live?

Was never supposed to be a single - became an emergency single after the "First Time" incident. I would have selected Lights or BT over it.

Question for Sterling (or anyone else who might know) -

Why was this song selected as the First Time replacement? To my ear, Lights is much catchier and, in the spirit of Foolin Yourself or Sing For The Day (both were singles) could have had better success on the charts than Why Me. Was this considered at all as a single?

Because Madonna..I mean Dennis pulled the Diva card.

Actually, it was the record company's choice, along with every single release from that era. Dennis had no ability to dictate singles. It was not Dennis' choice to release "First Time," either, it was theirs, in response to radio stations requesting a single on it. When Tommy said no to that, A&M went with 'Why Me,' probably hoping to continue the crossover pop success they'd had with "Babe." Dennis at that point was the only member who'd had crossover radio success, so it only makes sense they'd try to chase that and go with him and the voice that had just sang a #1 Top 40 hit, and 'Why Me' is really the only song left on the album of his that might have played well at Top 40 radio. Dennis has even said that he disagreed with the single choice of 'Why Me' because he thought it wasn't a hit single, just an album track in his opinion.

I don't know about "Lights," but as with anything a record company does, you can bet it was probably determined by some kind of market research.

Sterling

LOL....I remember getting in an argument over this very topic. The bottom line is that the label releases the album and singles, not the band.

The only question I would have is how could Tommy, or any other member, could veto a single release? I mean, if a member can't say, "I want this song as a single..." How can a member say, "Do not release that song as a single"

You have to look at it from a marketing and profit vs. loss point of view. If you're a record company executive and Tommy - who at that point was on the cover of every teen mag in America weekly - says, "I will quit if you do this," you are looking at that from the perspective of, "Okay, maybe we don't push this . . . are there any other singles here? Because this guy's absence makes a BIG difference in marketing this band." See what I mean?


Sterling

Toph wrote:

Rockwriter wrote:

gr8whitehope wrote:

Toph wrote:

Toph wrote:

Joe From Buffalo wrote:Have they ever played this one live?

Was never supposed to be a single - became an emergency single after the "First Time" incident. I would have selected Lights or BT over it.

Question for Sterling (or anyone else who might know) -

Why was this song selected as the First Time replacement? To my ear, Lights is much catchier and, in the spirit of Foolin Yourself or Sing For The Day (both were singles) could have had better success on the charts than Why Me. Was this considered at all as a single?

Because Madonna..I mean Dennis pulled the Diva card.

Actually, it was the record company's choice, along with every single release from that era. Dennis had no ability to dictate singles. It was not Dennis' choice to release "First Time," either, it was theirs, in response to radio stations requesting a single on it. When Tommy said no to that, A&M went with 'Why Me,' probably hoping to continue the crossover pop success they'd had with "Babe." Dennis at that point was the only member who'd had crossover radio success, so it only makes sense they'd try to chase that and go with him and the voice that had just sang a #1 Top 40 hit, and 'Why Me' is really the only song left on the album of his that might have played well at Top 40 radio. Dennis has even said that he disagreed with the single choice of 'Why Me' because he thought it wasn't a hit single, just an album track in his opinion.

I don't know about "Lights," but as with anything a record company does, you can bet it was probably determined by some kind of market research.

Sterling

Would this be the same crack marketing research team that chose as Love As The Ritual as the lead singer off Edge?

Let's face it, Styx was a stellar band, but many times, the folks at A&M and their marketing research team, tended to not pick the best songs for singles.

Actually, A&M wanted "Show Me the Way" for the first single from EOTC, and DENNIS pushed for LITR - which he later acknowledged as a questionable choice. By that time you have to understand they had signed a new deal that named Dennis as producer, and he had more latitude to insist. Isn't it interesting that he chose to insist on Glen, instead of himself? And yes, he was wrong, absolutely. No question. SMTW should have been the first single, no doubt. Why would you want to re-introduce a band who's been gone 7 years with a new, unfamiliar singer in a new, unfamiliar style, when you have a classic style Styx tune sung by the principal voice of Styx right there in hand? WRONG!!!!!!!!


Sterling