MR

So we'll get you to buy a ticket by promoting the songs we have no intention of performing. Of the 7 songs mentioned here, they don't perform 4. And don't tell me that this is the writer's fault. They get their material from press announcements written and approved by the band. Cavaet emptor with Styx!

http://www.falloncountyextra.com/2013/0 ... unty-fair/

Toph wrote:So we'll get you to buy a ticket by promoting the songs we have no intention of performing. Of the 7 songs mentioned here, they don't perform 4. And don't tell me that this is the writer's fault. They get their material from press announcements written and approved by the band. Cavaet emptor with Styx!

http://www.falloncountyextra.com/2013/0 ... unty-fair/

They certainly can't avoid mentioning songs that put them on the map when it comes to promotion. It seems they have no problem with those songs in that context.

if you guys honestly believe that management reviews and then approves a short blurb from a local newspaper for the Fallon County Fair you're delusional.

masque wrote:if you guys honestly believe that management reviews and then approves a short blurb from a local newspaper for the Fallon County Fair you're delusional.

Where do you think the newspaper gets their information?

Toph wrote:

masque wrote:if you guys honestly believe that management reviews and then approves a short blurb from a local newspaper for the Fallon County Fair you're delusional.

Where do you think the newspaper gets their information?

Wikipedia ?

masque wrote:if you guys honestly believe that management reviews and then approves a short blurb from a local newspaper for the Fallon County Fair you're delusional.

No I don't think that they review every single one. However, I am sure there is some review since they would not want to be in violation of the lawsuit settlement with DDY. For example, someone using DDY''s image or name by mistake in a promotion. My point was more about they have no issue when it comes to the success and recognition of DDY penned songs they personally don't like being a major building block to their success. Their happy to acknowledge it. Just like I am sure they had no problem with the money those songs made them.

Boomchild wrote:

masque wrote:if you guys honestly believe that management reviews and then approves a short blurb from a local newspaper for the Fallon County Fair you're delusional.

No I don't think that they review every single one. However, I am sure there is some review since they would not want to be in violation of the lawsuit settlement with DDY. For example, someone using DDY''s image or name by mistake in a promotion. My point was more about they have no issue when it comes to the success and recognition of DDY penned songs they personally don't like being a major building block to their success. Their happy to acknowledge it. Just like I am sure they had no problem with the money those songs made them.

well since their primary reason to carry on as "styx" instead of solo artists is because the name recognition that they created together provides a good living 4 decades later I agree they dont have a problem riding certain things that Dennis helped create.

look, there is no denying that dennis was the "ceo" and largest contributor, based on what we know of styx, during their heyday, much like roger waters was of pink floyd, like tom scholz was of boston, mick jones of foreigner, kevin cronin of reo, etc.....etc.....etc...

however, there is also no denying that even dennis himself credits the band as a whole for their accomplishments and says they never would have gotten to where they did without tommy and jy as well. and I think that they all played a large part in helping each other shape the songs (regardless of who wrote them), into better songs that reflected what these guys were as a band.

now all these decades later, they dont work together well and have chosen another route to play.

so tommy and jy won a court battle for them to use the name styx.....why shouldnt they? they helped create and make the brand worth something as well. it's not like they were simply hired hands....tommy was a huge writer, the main focus of providing the "show" live and was the only real eye candy for the band during their heyday.

jy was very vocal live and was a huge part of their live sound and "rock" element of what them such a good "rock band" live. and he did contribute a handful of songs that were very much an important part of helping styx appeal to a wider audience that loved the hits but also wanted to know styx was a hard rock band as well.

so , why would tommy and jy oppose someone loving "the best of times"? they helped create the final product, the product we hear on the radio and the video we saw back in the day. it wasnt dennis alone.

so to me, once they won the court battle to carry on as styx, there is no way in hell I would walk away from what that meant to me finacially in the twilight of my career......and neither have they.

ALL artists would prefer to go out and play new material, it keeps things fresh and interesting......but almost none of these bands from the 70's can draw an audience at all unless about 80-90% of the setlist is a walk down memory lane.

so if the only true way you can make a living these days, in today's music industry, is to play the stuff that made you famous the first time, then by natural default you are fool if you dont continue doing that.

it's just good business and that's why they dont have a problem doing it.

and here is the truly ironic part of this whole argument that rages on all these later.......

if dennis had won the court battle and been able to block them from using the name styx and instead it was deemed legal for him to call his solo band styx, I would bet all of my future earnings on the fact that he would absolutely 100% call his current band STYX.

it would make him a hell alot more money because he would be able to draw larger audiences and the name recognition alone would be worth many thousands of dollars per year.....plus open the door for him to get on some of the big package tours.

but nobody ever talks about this, because he cant legally do it.....but if he could he would.....in a "chicago" minute.

why??? because it just makes good business sense.

There was no court battle. Dennis and "Styx" settled before it got to a court hearing.

masque wrote:well since their primary reason to carry on as "styx" instead of solo artists is because the name recognition that they created together provides a good living 4 decades later I agree they dont have a problem riding certain things that Dennis helped create.

look, there is no denying that dennis was the "ceo" and largest contributor, based on what we know of styx, during their heyday, much like roger waters was of pink floyd, like tom scholz was of boston, mick jones of foreigner, kevin cronin of reo, etc.....etc.....etc...

however, there is also no denying that even dennis himself credits the band as a whole for their accomplishments and says they never would have gotten to where they did without tommy and jy as well. and I think that they all played a large part in helping each other shape the songs (regardless of who wrote them), into better songs that reflected what these guys were as a band.

now all these decades later, they dont work together well and have chosen another route to play.

so tommy and jy won a court battle for them to use the name styx.....why shouldnt they? they helped create and make the brand worth something as well. it's not like they were simply hired hands....tommy was a huge writer, the main focus of providing the "show" live and was the only real eye candy for the band during their heyday.

jy was very vocal live and was a huge part of their live sound and "rock" element of what them such a good "rock band" live. and he did contribute a handful of songs that were very much an important part of helping styx appeal to a wider audience that loved the hits but also wanted to know styx was a hard rock band as well.

so , why would tommy and jy oppose someone loving "the best of times"? they helped create the final product, the product we hear on the radio and the video we saw back in the day. it wasnt dennis alone.

so to me, once they won the court battle to carry on as styx, there is no way in hell I would walk away from what that meant to me finacially in the twilight of my career......and neither have they.

ALL artists would prefer to go out and play new material, it keeps things fresh and interesting......but almost none of these bands from the 70's can draw an audience at all unless about 80-90% of the setlist is a walk down memory lane.

so if the only true way you can make a living these days, in today's music industry, is to play the stuff that made you famous the first time, then by natural default you are fool if you dont continue doing that.

it's just good business and that's why they dont have a problem doing it.

My viewpoint has nothing to do with who exactly wrote the songs, saying that Dennis was the only creative person in the band or who "owns" the rights to the name Styx. I merely pointing out that it's two faced when on hand you take the accolades for certain songs that made you a successful act and on the other you bash or thumb your nose at those very same songs. That's all I am saying.

masque wrote:and here is the truly ironic part of this whole argument that rages on all these later.......

if dennis had won the court battle and been able to block them from using the name styx and instead it was deemed legal for him to call his solo band styx, I would bet all of my future earnings on the fact that he would absolutely 100% call his current band STYX.

it would make him a hell alot more money because he would be able to draw larger audiences and the name recognition alone would be worth many thousands of dollars per year.....plus open the door for him to get on some of the big package tours.

but nobody ever talks about this, because he cant legally do it.....but if he could he would.....in a "chicago" minute.

why??? because it just makes good business sense.

I think your mistaken. If you listen to Dennis talk about the band it's clear that the band was more then just a business and money to him. You even pointed out in your comment above about how Dennis felt Styx would not be what it was without Tommy and JY. I doubt that Dennis' motivation and goal was to gain sole control of the Styx name to be able to bill a band with other players and call it Styx. In fact, remember that when Tommy left in '83 all the others wanted to move on without Tommy and Dennis was the only one against it because he felt it would not be the same band. It seems to me that Dennis' motivation to bring the lawsuit was because the others tried to walk away with the whole thing and royally screw Dennis on his co ownership of it. Not to mention that it was a clear violation of a biding contract they all agreed to. His other big concern was he felt filling the band with replacements would hurt the image and legacy of the band. To make it clear I am not debating that subject since it is a dead horse on both sides of the fence. If Dennis had won sole ownership, I really doubt that he would be doing the package tours since I think it's pretty clear that he would not want o be on the road that much at this stage of his career. In my opinion to Dennis it was more about protecting the legacy of the band and his rightful co ownership based on what they all agreed to.

Boomchild wrote:

masque wrote:and here is the truly ironic part of this whole argument that rages on all these later.......

if dennis had won the court battle and been able to block them from using the name styx and instead it was deemed legal for him to call his solo band styx, I would bet all of my future earnings on the fact that he would absolutely 100% call his current band STYX.

it would make him a hell alot more money because he would be able to draw larger audiences and the name recognition alone would be worth many thousands of dollars per year.....plus open the door for him to get on some of the big package tours.

but nobody ever talks about this, because he cant legally do it.....but if he could he would.....in a "chicago" minute.

why??? because it just makes good business sense.

I think your mistaken. If you listen to Dennis talk about the band it's clear that the band was more then just a business and money to him. You even pointed out in your comment above about how Dennis felt Styx would not be what it was without Tommy and JY. I doubt that Dennis' motivation and goal was to gain sole control of the Styx name to be able to bill a band with other players and call it Styx. In fact, remember that when Tommy left in '83 all the others wanted to move on without Tommy and Dennis was the only one against it because he felt it would not be the same band. It seems to me that Dennis' motivation to bring the lawsuit was because the others tried to walk away with the whole thing and royally screw Dennis on his co ownership of it. Not to mention that it was a clear violation of a biding contract they all agreed to. His other big concern was he felt filling the band with replacements would hurt the image and legacy of the band. To make it clear I am not debating that subject since it is a dead horse on both sides of the fence. If Dennis had won sole ownership, I really doubt that he would be doing the package tours since I think it's pretty clear that he would not want o be on the road that much at this stage of his career. In my opinion to Dennis it was more about protecting the legacy of the band and his rightful co ownership based on what they all agreed to.

Agree with this. For me, it is not so much the fact that Tommy and JY won the name. (Although, they've paid a pretty high financial price to "win" the name.) Its about the revisionist history and the purposeful ignoring of a good chunk of the hit catalog and hit albums. Dennis is much closer to accurately representing all facets of Styx in terms of his show. JY and Tommy's ignoring of half the band's catalog, elimination of DDY from the website, and rewriting of history damages the legacy of the band. That is what irritates me.

It's irritating, yes. But ANYBODY WHO IS A STYX FAN knows what the real deal is. The only people that're thinking how neat it is, are those that persuaded Styx to try and erase Dennis from their history. I HIGHLY doubt Tommy, JY, and Chuck sat at a table one night and said "Hey, let's rewrite all of our history and pull Dennis out of it". If they did, they shouldn't have, but to me, that screams "Management's idea".

brywool wrote:It's irritating, yes. But ANYBODY WHO IS A STYX FAN knows what the real deal is. The only people that're thinking how neat it is, are those that persuaded Styx to try and erase Dennis from their history. I HIGHLY doubt Tommy, JY, and Chuck sat at a table one night and said "Hey, let's rewrite all of our history and pull Dennis out of it". If they did, they shouldn't have, but to me, that screams "Management's idea".

Well Bruscoe is a completely slime ball in the industry so I wouldn't put it past him.

The one thing that keeps the history and legacy in check is the Original Greatest Hits album. It is by far and away their biggest compilation seller and outside of substituting Rockin the Paradise for Miss America, it is about as true to their most impactful hits as any greatest hits album by any artist.

No one can take that one away.

brywool wrote:It's irritating, yes. But ANYBODY WHO IS A STYX FAN knows what the real deal is. The only people that're thinking how neat it is, are those that persuaded Styx to try and erase Dennis from their history. I HIGHLY doubt Tommy, JY, and Chuck sat at a table one night and said "Hey, let's rewrite all of our history and pull Dennis out of it". If they did, they shouldn't have, but to me, that screams "Management's idea".

So are you trying to say that neither Tommy, JY, Chuck have no responsibility simply because they did not come up with the idea? Who's band is it then? Who's in control? Ultimately, they are responsible. If that is the way it happened, then that just goes to show you how much or lack of respect they have for Dennis and his contributions to their success.

Toph wrote:So we'll get you to buy a ticket by promoting the songs we have no intention of performing. Of the 7 songs mentioned here, they don't perform 4. And don't tell me that this is the writer's fault. They get their material from press announcements written and approved by the band. Cavaet emptor with Styx!

http://www.falloncountyextra.com/2013/0 ... unty-fair/

How can this be false advertisement when it isn't an advertisement. I'm sure the band sent the writer or her publication press materials if they requested them, but they are not required to use them. They also do not have to get anyone's approval for what they write. They could write how DDY is in the band and unless someone could prove that the band or an agent of the band stated this the band would not be liable.

I'm sure every article about an upcoming Radiohead show will mention "Creep" and the band didn't perform the song for 10 years and still rarely plays it. I'm also quite sure that the song is not in promotional material from the band.