New "Brave New World" video

[Monker]

Interesting they would do this...

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=K2W3H15V-xA

[gr8dane]

I like sci-fi.I like the song and the video.Well done.

[ChicagoSTYX]

Strange that they would do this now..... I wonder if DDY needed to sign off on this.

[yogi]

I thought the same exact thing. I think Dennis would have since I believe he produced the song and was with Styx at the time.

The video & the song are very relevant today as so many Styx & DDY songs are. Almost like they had a ‘Crystal Ball’ into the screwed up future. Dream Theater said it best in one of their songs ‘whose out there to save us from ourselves’.

Anyway I hope Dennis did have to sign off on this. Maybe it got him & Tommy talking. Even if they didn’t talk but Dennis had to sign off on it, it’s an act of good faith on something they created.

[FormerDJMike]

No, I don't think that's the case at all. Anyone can make a video of a song. I could make one if I knew how to do it with animation and no permission is needed. There is one out there that is very similar and fan-made of Red Storm. As for production, all the Tommy and JY tunes were produced by Tommy and JY and Dennis only produced his own songs on BNW.

Red Storm video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Db3Wg9cXmJI

[yogi]

So if President Trump, Joe Biden etc plays a song with some sort of video in the background or they just film the song playing with the video rolling like they are creating a video for the song it’s all perfectly legal?

If so then they can use any song they want at any time with no permission from the artist.

[FormerDJMike]

So if President Trump, Joe Biden etc plays a song with some sort of video in the background or they just film the song playing with the video rolling like they are creating a video for the song it’s all perfectly legal?

If so then they can use any song they want at any time with no permission from the artist.

That's different. For political or advertising you have to get permission from the author of the song and the author only and pay a royalty fee. Everything else falls under "Fair Use".

Even if permission were needed for the BNW video Tommy and JY are the authors of the song. Let's say Quincy Jones produced it. They don't need his permission to use the song only the copyright holders.

[Monker]

So if President Trump, Joe Biden etc plays a song with some sort of video in the background or they just film the song playing with the video rolling like they are creating a video for the song it’s all perfectly legal?

If so then they can use any song they want at any time with no permission from the artist.

That's different. For political or advertising you have to get permission from the author of the song and the author only and pay a royalty fee. Everything else falls under "Fair Use".

Even if permission were needed for the BNW video Tommy and JY are the authors of the song. Let's say Quincy Jones produced it. They don't need his permission to use the song only the copyright holders.

This is all true...Obviously, if they used DDY's "image" in any way, they would need his permission.

It also seems I remember somebody here mentioning performance videos, especially if they are for sale. Such as the PoE/GI stuff that Styx released. Do they not need permission to release those? Or, is that just past videos with DDY? LIke, if they wanted to release an old concert on DVD/Blu-ray?

But, for a simple video like this, with no band images at all, they don't need anybody' permission.

[StyxGuy]

It also seems I remember somebody here mentioning performance videos, especially if they are for sale. Such as the PoE/GI stuff that Styx released. Do they not need permission to release those? Or, is that just past videos with DDY? LIke, if they wanted to release an old concert on DVD/Blu-ray?

There is *some* kind of agreement that exists with Dennis, Tommy and JY about his 'cut' of Styx as that was part of the lawsuit settlement. I am fairly certain JY and Dennis have alluded to this in more recent years without really saying what the deal is. JY had said something about how they go on the road and Dennis 'gets his cut'. So at least live, they seem to be paying him to perform the songs he wrote? (which would also make sense as to why Styx would want to play as few DDY songs as possible)

If they had a concert that was filmed and never released, yes I do think Dennis would have to provide permission (or rather, he would ask for a pay-out or cut of the sales). Really though, unless we know what their agreement is, it could be as simple as they forward a cheque for X dollars to Dennis once a year or it could be more complex.

Look at Roger Waters and Pink Floyd. He, Nick Mason and David Gilmour all have to agree on PF re-releases, or else they don't happen. Most recent, David and Roger argued about the Animals album (expanded edition, as they've done with The Wall, DSOM and Wish You Were Here) and couldn't come to an agreement so the project is once again delayed with no timeline for release.

[Monker]

It also seems I remember somebody here mentioning performance videos, especially if they are for sale. Such as the PoE/GI stuff that Styx released. Do they not need permission to release those? Or, is that just past videos with DDY? LIke, if they wanted to release an old concert on DVD/Blu-ray?

There is *some* kind of agreement that exists with Dennis, Tommy and JY about his 'cut' of Styx as that was part of the lawsuit settlement. I am fairly certain JY and Dennis have alluded to this in more recent years without really saying what the deal is. JY had said something about how they go on the road and Dennis 'gets his cut'. So at least live, they seem to be paying him to perform the songs he wrote? (which would also make sense as to why Styx would want to play as few DDY songs as possible)

If they had a concert that was filmed and never released, yes I do think Dennis would have to provide permission (or rather, he would ask for a pay-out or cut of the sales). Really though, unless we know what their agreement is, it could be as simple as they forward a cheque for X dollars to Dennis once a year or it could be more complex.

Look at Roger Waters and Pink Floyd. He, Nick Mason and David Gilmour all have to agree on PF re-releases, or else they don't happen. Most recent, David and Roger argued about the Animals album (expanded edition, as they've done with The Wall, DSOM and Wish You Were Here) and couldn't come to an agreement so the project is once again delayed with no timeline for release.

No, this isn't what I am talking about.

First, concert performances. The band can perform whatever they want. They could perform "Desert Moon" and there is nothing Dennis can do about it. I believe it goes that the RIAA fees are paid, by the venue, and then Dennis gets paid from that. Dennis may get part of the merchandise, or possibly whatever the venue pays the band, but he can NOT dictate what the band plays.

I know this was talked about years ago when Styx was releasing their string of concert CD/DVDs. There is some weird rule where they can record and release "whatever" on CD. But, they need Dennis' permission to release it on DVD. So, for the PoE/GI cd/dvd, they needed Dennis' permission...and he needed Tommy/JY's permission for songs on his last DVD. So, IMO, they made a deal to do both. This has nothing to do with the court settlement, it is how performance copyrights work.

So, they can't release an official concert video for an old song that Dennis has credits on. It seems like "Brave New World" may just be Tommy/JY, so maybe they can do that. But, I don't think they can for a song that Dennis is credited on...something to do with performance rights, or whatever.

[StyxGuy]

No, this isn't what I am talking about.

First, concert performances. The band can perform whatever they want. They could perform "Desert Moon" and there is nothing Dennis can do about it. I believe it goes that the RIAA fees are paid, by the venue, and then Dennis gets paid from that. Dennis may get part of the merchandise, or possibly whatever the venue pays the band, but he can NOT dictate what the band plays.

I know this was talked about years ago when Styx was releasing their string of concert CD/DVDs. There is some weird rule where they can record and release "whatever" on CD. But, they need Dennis' permission to release it on DVD. So, for the PoE/GI cd/dvd, they needed Dennis' permission...and he needed Tommy/JY's permission for songs on his last DVD. So, IMO, they made a deal to do both. This has nothing to do with the court settlement, it is how performance copyrights work.

So, they can't release an official concert video for an old song that Dennis has credits on. It seems like "Brave New World" may just be Tommy/JY, so maybe they can do that. But, I don't think they can for a song that Dennis is credited on...something to do with performance rights, or whatever.

Ah... here's Dennis explaining the performance rights stuff in this interview, touches more on the live performance/recording aspect but yeah, it all comes down to copyright ownership and permissions depending on what you're doing.

https://www.classicrockrevisited.com/sh ... hp?id=1075

[Monker]

No, this isn't what I am talking about.

First, concert performances. The band can perform whatever they want. They could perform "Desert Moon" and there is nothing Dennis can do about it. I believe it goes that the RIAA fees are paid, by the venue, and then Dennis gets paid from that. Dennis may get part of the merchandise, or possibly whatever the venue pays the band, but he can NOT dictate what the band plays.

I know this was talked about years ago when Styx was releasing their string of concert CD/DVDs. There is some weird rule where they can record and release "whatever" on CD. But, they need Dennis' permission to release it on DVD. So, for the PoE/GI cd/dvd, they needed Dennis' permission...and he needed Tommy/JY's permission for songs on his last DVD. So, IMO, they made a deal to do both. This has nothing to do with the court settlement, it is how performance copyrights work.

So, they can't release an official concert video for an old song that Dennis has credits on. It seems like "Brave New World" may just be Tommy/JY, so maybe they can do that. But, I don't think they can for a song that Dennis is credited on...something to do with performance rights, or whatever.

Ah... here's Dennis explaining the performance rights stuff in this interview, touches more on the live performance/recording aspect but yeah, it all comes down to copyright ownership and permissions depending on what you're doing.

https://www.classicrockrevisited.com/sh ... hp?id=1075

Correct...this is what I was talking about from that interview. If Dennis had any rights to that song, they would need his permission to do a video:

From the link above:

Here is how it works: You or anyone else in the world can record any song ever written by anybody on a record or CD. As long as it is just recorded music then you can do that, as long as you don’t change the lyrics or the chords appreciatively. In order to put it into another medium such as film, TV commercials or a Broadway musical, any time it appears in another medium then it is up to the songwriter or songwriters to grant permission- that is how it works. Let me be more clear, because it is not always up to the songwriter, it is up to the publisher.

Sometimes songwriters have control over their copyrights. The Beatles never did. Those things are up to the publisher to use in any way they saw fit. Some artists got smarter and that is why some of the compositions that I have written I control completely, and some I do not. The ones that I do not are in the hands of the publishing company as to whether they will give you what is called a synch license to synch music up to picture, and that is how it works.

[gr8dane]

Guess it would be ok to make the videos,as long as the video makers don't profit from it.

[FormerDJMike]

Here is one I made. I didn't ask permission and I don't make money on it. I did it for fun to show off the clear vinyl. However YouTube has it has a copyright so anytime someone watches it, royalties go to the publisher/author.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UKEro5jLk_I

[StyxGuy]

Here is one I made. I didn't ask permission and I don't make money on it. I did it for fun to show off the clear vinyl. However YouTube has it has a copyright so anytime someone watches it, royalties go to the publisher/author.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UKEro5jLk_I

It seems to be down to the copyright holders when it comes to this. I've posted Styx 'needle drops' (the radio special) and only had the copyright/monetization claim happen. I've put up AC/DC and Fleetwood Mac and they were copyright claimed and auto-blocked from being viewed.

[ztyxlynne]

I wonder if he would have to sign off on it? I would think so esp since you can hear his voice on the song and was a official member of the band at that time.

[Monker]

I wonder if he would have to sign off on it? I would think so esp since you can hear his voice on the song and was a official member of the band at that time.

No, I don't think so. He is not a cowriter and I doubt that he owns the publishing rights to it.

What I have always found interesting is what Dennis says in what I quoted above about getting the rights to certain Tommy songs to release on his DVD. He goes out of his way to say how thankful his is, etc. I certainly believe it was Tommy or his publishing company who gave him those rights...and I believe Dennis or his publishing company had to give Styx the rights to the GI/PoE songs for that live DVD. IE: they traded niceties. Now, it could be that Tommy doesn't own the rights to those songs any longer and it is just a publishing company that Dennis was dealing with...if so, I'd like to know that...just interesting.

[yogi]

Great info

[gr8dane]

just finished Chuck's book.
He says that ,at the end of the recording of the album BNW, he was too sick with HIV
to come in for some of the final recording sessions.
JY calls Chuck to say Dennis is not going to credit him for being on the album,
because he didn't play on the last track.
Chuck eventually gets picked up by JY,so he can come in and finish up the loose ends.
Dennis wants the other guys to accommodate him, yet he is not going to wait for someone else.
Good ole Dennis.

[StyxGuy]

just finished Chuck's book.
He says that ,at the end of the recording of the album BNW, he was too sick with HIV
to come in for some of the final recording sessions.
JY calls Chuck to say Dennis is not going to credit him for being on the album,
because he didn't play on the last track.
Chuck eventually gets picked up by JY,so he can come in and finish up the loose ends.
Dennis wants the other guys to accommodate him, yet he is not going to wait for someone else.
Good ole Dennis.

For anyone without the book, here's an excerpt from that part;
-------------
About a week later, I got a call form JY saying, "Chuck -- I've got some bad news. Dennis doesn't want you put your name on the album since you didn't actually play on the final cut."

I said, "Pick me up tomorrow. We're laying my track."
He asked, "Are you sure Chuck? We'll fight to get you on anyway."
I said, "I don't want to be put on the album gratuitously. I want to lay the track."
-------------

Upon the release of the book he did some interviews, in one he was asked about a reunion with Dennis;

His response? "Before any more of us die, I would hope that it could happen. Every year that it doesn't happen is another year that goes by. And if you wait too long, who will care?"

https://www.tampabay.com/archive/2007/0 ... ot-stones/

[gr8dane]

just finished Chuck's book.
He says that ,at the end of the recording of the album BNW, he was too sick with HIV
to come in for some of the final recording sessions.
JY calls Chuck to say Dennis is not going to credit him for being on the album,
because he didn't play on the last track.
Chuck eventually gets picked up by JY,so he can come in and finish up the loose ends.
Dennis wants the other guys to accommodate him, yet he is not going to wait for someone else.
Good ole Dennis.

For anyone without the book, here's an excerpt from that part;
-------------
About a week later, I got a call form JY saying, "Chuck -- I've got some bad news. Dennis doesn't want you put your name on the album since you didn't actually play on the final cut."

I said, "Pick me up tomorrow. We're laying my track."
He asked, "Are you sure Chuck? We'll fight to get you on anyway."
I said, "I don't want to be put on the album gratuitously. I want to lay the track."
-------------

Upon the release of the book he did some interviews, in one he was asked about a reunion with Dennis;

His response? "Before any more of us die, I would hope that it could happen. Every year that it doesn't happen is another year that goes by. And if you wait too long, who will care?"

https://www.tampabay.com/archive/2007/0 ... ot-stones/

Ah ,great,thanks for that.
Guess Tommy and JY had to talk some sense to Chuck about reunion.