Glen Burtnik's Styx departure

[Big J]

I havent heard much about what happened, so forgive me if this has been "gone over" 100 times.

What happened with Burtnik's departure from Styx after the Cyclorama tour? I've seen a couple comments from him here and there that indicate it was less than amicable, but no details.

I thought he was a great fit for the band, brought a lot to the table.

[SuiteMadameBlue]

He wanted to spend more time with his family. I'll find his Dear Glen's that explain it.

Don't worry about asking anything, ask away!!!

[LordofDaRing]

I think Suite hit the nail on the head, in addition, and this is Glen talking, he felt there were other ways to promote the band other than tour non stop. He also felt he had no voice or say so.

[styxfanNH]

i'm sure I'll be corrected, but this is the jist of it.

When Glen rejoined the band as the bass player the original plan was to do about 50-80 dates or so and then see what happened. That then turned into about 150 shows a year for 3 years or so. For Glen this was never supposed to be a long term thing.

Well at the end of the three or so years, Glen realizes that he missed the things that he cared about the most by being on the road some 200 days a year or so - his family. IN fact, his oldest daughter was a freshman when he left for the road and had completed high school by the time he returned. He didn't want the same thing to happen to his youngest daughtee and after a bunch of reflection and talk with his family, he decided to return home.

Up until the last year or so, the company line pretty much was he left to spend more time with his family and that he was in good terms with the guys from Styx. In fact everything has been amicable.

So in that veign I would say what you have heard is wrong.

Recently, Glen's scheduled dates with Dennis have caused some of us to go back and look at the pieces of Glen's puzzle another time. Reading the tea leaves and putting a spin on things the only way Styx fans can, we look at a recent Dear Glen where it appears that he takes a shot at Glen and JY as well as looking at the way he thanks the members of Styx in Welcome to Hollywood (Thanks to Tommy Shaw for Employment Opportunities) and one can read into things that not all were as they seemed.

I would also say that for Glen, it has always been about the music, not the politics. He said his fair share about Dennis a while ago after his departure. For whatever reason, glen has decided to burry the hatchet with Dennis and perform with him again.

With Styx there is always a hidden story, and we do our best to sniff it out every day.

[LordofDaRing]

Actually if you are referring to my comments about Glen, you can check out his website and not read any tealeafs. His comments about wanting to promote the band in other ways and knowing that he will never have any control of the band are his comments. I am not saying that to slam Tommy and JY. He always has nothing but good things to say about them as professionals, etc. IMO, I feel that this democracy they felt that did not exist under Dennis, still does not exist under them. They talk the talk but in the end they don't walk the walk. I think his comments about creative control are said out of frustration. Think about those deragotory comments he made about Dennis, he might have been playing the party line on that one, potentially burning a bridge. Then after all of that he is not treated as an equal. That all being said, if all went well for him creatively, I agree with you the touring schedule would have caused him to quit. Nice to know that DDY is/was not the only one who wanted to live on the road.

[ek88]

Personally, when Styx decided to move on without Dennis, I think they should've done it wholeheartedly, ie. not putting limits on the creative inputs of Glen and Larry. If the idea was for the BAND to come first, there would be no pre-determined notions as far as who gets how many songs, or that the first single had to be one with Tommy's vocals, etc. The best songs should make the album, regardless of who writes or sings them.

I think most people would agree that Kiss Your Ass Goodbye was the most modern sounding song on the album and probably should've been the first single released. However, it was probably the least Styx-sounding song, as well. But again, if they wanted to move on, that should've been okay, because like it or not, leaving Dennis behind leaves some of the signature Styx sound behind. It's hard to get a read on this band. Sometimes they seem like they want nothing to do with their past, other times they can't seem to let go.

Having said that, I love Cyclorama to death, and would've preferred a little less touring to keep Glen in the band, and some more new music, as opposed to all the endless touring and a covers album. Just my 2 cents.

[SuiteMadameBlue]

Big J and others, here is the link to read all of Glen's "Dear Glen".

http://www.glenburtnik.com/dearglen.htm


Here's his answers to a few regarding Styx/Dennis, only a few:

At the moment, it seems there is more interest in Europe than in the US for my music. However, I'm looking into a few things and there should be some sort of way to purchase my CDs domestically (the States) soon.

My relationship with Styx is fine but the last time I spoke with Dennis was at the Children's Miracle Network performance in Spring of 1999. But I must say, it saddens me to read your concern that I might "be ugly" while answering a question. I guess by some of my past public statements you might've gotten the impression I was kind of a "pissed-off" guy, ready to bark. Well, that's what I get, I suppose. I apologize if I've seemed like a jackass that way.

Thanks very much for the interest,

Glen

Lotsa questions there! I'm glad you like my work, and proud to make your 'desert island' list.

Determining which songs to be released as singles is usually decided by a combination of the artist, the management and the record label. It is a decision that has always made me nuts - so much rides on the first choice. In the case of Cyclorama, if I'm not mistaken it was Tommy & JY's decision. No marketing research. Usually friends, relatives and radio programmers are asked for opinions. And it ain't about fairness, it's about wanting to be as effective as possible.

It's a tough decision to make. I personally think the stand out track on many an album goes unheard by radio listeners. Cyclorama is one of those records, if you ask me.

"Love Is the Ritual" was JY & Dennis' call, as I recall. It was a disappointment to me that the song didn't do as well as I'd hoped. I think it had a lot to do with it NOT sounding like Styx.

In which case that's a good argument for not releasing 'Kiss Your Ass Goodbye' as a Styx single. But not to worry, I have recorded a version of the song for my own album and although a solo Glen Burtnik album might not get the attention one by Styx would, my version is slamming.

Thanks for your kind letter,

Glen

Thanks for the supportive words.

I actually put up with some grief (from fans) when I first joined the band, and since I've come to realize my place in the group's history without delusion or ego.

As long as Styx doesn't eclipse their formidable success in the late seventies/early 80s, I will fall into a position of quasi-importance.

Which is fair.

It's true my stamp is on Cyclorama, as that was a collaborative project. However, in the simple economical politics of these matters, it is not really my place to be much more than a supportive member of this very professional group. Otherwise, I'd have much more of a say in decision making and would sing more than one song per show.

Again, this is all fair. It was really the work of Chuck & John Panozzo, Dennis DeYoung, John Curlewski, James Young and Tommy Shaw that made the brand name "Styx" the valueable commodity it is today, and I am proud to have contributed what I could to this enduring act.

As for Styx fans who think I'm more valuable than that, I am extremely grateful. Honest.

And I appreciate your thoughtfulness in letting me eat uninterupted, but I am usually happy to talk to anyone who is interested in saying hi. Talking about music gear is as much fun for me as talking about cars must've been to the pre-Viet Nam generation...

Thanks much,

Glen

Thanks very much. I'm glad you enjoy my music. "Hole In My Pocket" is an oldie, written with my wildly talented friend Bob Miller. Nobody ever mentions that one to me, and I used to really like it. I still do.

"Love Is The Ritual" was a tune I had ready for my 3rd solo album on A&M before the deal went sour (one of my managers physically threatened a label Executive and that was that). Soon after, Styx came along and asked for material and the song became their first single off the Edge album. Those are interesting chart statistics you've brought to my attention. I guess I always was annoyed that my stints with Styx amounted to what they were. I ultimately felt like Dennis' voice was the sound radio was interested in playing, so there was essentially little I could do to effect the band…but I DID write a good portion of “Love At First Sight”, so I guess I took the writer role back then. Since I got a bit of a cold shoulder from earlier Styx fans, I pretty much wrote off the entire exercise.

To answer your questions:
1. No other singles were released off the Edge Of The Century album because it got to be time for Styx to renegotiate with A&M records after the 3rd single. Simply put, the band asked for more than A&M thought they were worth so A&M pulled out, Styx went fishing for another record deal, and A&M felt they had little to gain by investing in any more music off that album. It's all about business.
2. The next single release off of Edge? Good question. It was so long ago, I haven't a clue. I will say this” in this day and age, whenever an album has more than a few singles, either someone's not paying attention or the earlier singles were monster hits. It's rare an album gets up to bat more than 2 or 3 times.
3. The decision on which song gets to be chosen to be the single varies. Most often it's a consensus between the artist and the label's staff. For better or for worse, I've never had any say in the career of Styx, and I'm sorta cool with that.
4. As I recall, 'Love At First Sight' was rarely performed live because either the timing was off, or Dennis didn't think it sounded good or something. Again, I had little say in Styx decisions.
5. Boy, you really must've liked Edge of Century, you would've released half the album as singles!

That was all quite a long time ago. I tend to regard that album as a bit spotty, with a few high points. The first time I heard 'Show Me The Way' (Dennis asked me to harmonize the chorus of it with he & JY) I knew it was a strong song. My only regret is that my contributions didn't leave more of a dent - it would've changed things considerable I think. But it is what it is and I accept all of it. I don't think I ever necessarily belonged in that band to be honest.

Glen

PS I'm down to too few copies of "Heroes and Zeroes" to be able to even leave each of my children copies after I've kicked the bucket!

[Ash]

Glen is a man who, like me, has his opinions about anything and will spout them off at a moment's notice. What you wind up with is usually something very candid and heart-felt. I think this may be something strangely has made me appreciate Glen (the musician/artist) more. Because you know that you're going to get what he thinks - no matter how it comes out.

He does go back and will apologize for, as he puts it "Shooting my mouth off", but I'm sure at the time he really DID feel that Styx wasn't a band - but a collection of people who would put up with it's leader. I'm sure he DOES feel that his contributions were underappreciated.

It'd be like if you got signed as a free agent by the New England Patriots the year after winning the superbowl and to work you butt off - only to have the team go 8-8 and miss the playoffs one year, and then 2-14 the next. You'd feel frustrated and wonder why after you got there you weren't the 12-4, and 15-1 that you were the year before you got there.

Good..... bad..... or indifferent..... I think that the things Glen writes about are truth based on his world view and are accurate reflections of how he feels without worrying about "which side will I piss off today". Even after I go to this show in NJ, I expect at some point for glen to post something that will get everyone thinking he and Dennis aren't getting along.... as Tommy Shaw would say... "It's the nature of the beast".