LEGAL RAMIFICATIONS

[yogi]

We all know that Dennis, JY, Tommy, and Chuck have been to court to resolve numerous legal issues regarding the Styx name.

What would happen if Dennis, Chuck, Tommy, Glen and Todd got together as a group to record new music and tour? They ask JY to join them, but he JY stays the bitter child and says no.

Would Dennis, Chuck, Tommy, Glen and Todd be able to use the Styx name??


P.S. Whoooaaa, I almost forgot, Since JY said no and Froy wants it so bad, Lawerence is also added to the mix of Dennis, Chuck, Tommy, Glen & Todd.

[sadie65]

I'm pretty sure the answer would be no they couldn't use the name. Tommy, as far as I know doesn't have ownership of the name, nor Todd. I would think Dennis had to give ownership up for the settlement. Glen doesn't own it. That leaves JY as owner of the name.

Given your scenario...don't think so.

[yogi]

But doesnt Chuck have his and John's??

What about Gowan, surely he has some type of ownership in the Styx name!!!!

[sadie65]

But doesnt Chuck have his and John's??

I don't believe so though I cannot say for sure. I believe that he no longer owns it outright at the very least.

[froy]

P.S. Whoooaaa, I almost forgot, Since JY said no and Froy wants it so bad, Lawerence is also added to the mix of Dennis, Chuck, Tommy, Glen & Todd.

[/quote]

What the hell is the matter with you ?
Lawrence can be the truck driver
We dont need em when Dennis is around
He adds nothing to the mix

[froy]

What about Gowan, surely he has some type of ownership in the Styx name!!!!

[/quote]

He has ownership in a Tim Hortons more than he does in the STYX name and stop calling me Shirley.

[yogi]

Truck Driver????

What about Gowan and his motorcycle stunts????

What happened to Yaz??????????????????????

[froy]

Truck Driver????

What about Gowan and his motorcycle stunts????

Fine take the motorcycle and try to jump over The Grand Canyon see if he can do it
I dare him /

[yogi]

What happened to Yaz???

Who the hell was he???

No one has EVER answered that question for me.

[whocares]

He adds nothing to the mix

the hell he doesn't, he'll always have that spinning keyboard thing as a gimmick. oooh ahhhhh.

Nope, you're right, he add's nothing to the mix.

[SuiteMadameBlue]

From what my understanding, JY has "majority" control over the name Styx.

Larry, Todd, Glen and we can't forget Ricky are hired musicians for the most part. Not in any control of the business name Styx.

[SuiteMadameBlue]

What happened to Yaz???

Who the hell was he???

No one has EVER answered that question for me.

You mean the Styx roadie Yaz Jastrembski ??? What would you like to know about Yaz?

[Blue Falcon]

If they tried that, just look at what happened to Yes when they tried to make an album without Chris Squire: they had to tour under the unwieldy name of Anderson, Bruford, Wakeman, & Howe. That sounds like a law firm, not a rock band.

So JY would only allow them to tour as Shaw, Burtnik, Gowan, Maybe Panozzo, and That Other Guy.

Either that or they would have to tour as STYNX.

[StyxCollector]

From what my understanding, JY has "majority" control over the name Styx.

Larry, Todd, Glen and we can't forget Ricky are hired musicians for the most part. Not in any control of the business name Styx.

And what is still unclear is what happened when TS sold his "shares" in 1991 and then came back in 1996 - I mean, was he brought back but as a "lesser partner", or does he do it on a contract basis a la Gowan, Glen, Ricky, and Todd?

It's very clear that at this point, JY controls how the Styx name is used.

[SuiteMadameBlue]

From what my understanding, JY has "majority" control over the name Styx.

Larry, Todd, Glen and we can't forget Ricky are hired musicians for the most part. Not in any control of the business name Styx.

And what is still unclear is what happened when TS sold his "shares" in 1991 and then came back in 1996 - I mean, was he brought back but as a "lesser partner", or does he do it on a contract basis a la Gowan, Glen, Ricky, and Todd?

It's very clear that at this point, JY controls how the Styx name is used.

I thought he was part of a new contract, but not as a huge partner as before. Just IMO, nothing more.

[StyxCollector]

I thought he was part of a new contract, but not as a huge partner as before. Just IMO, nothing more.

That's what I thought, but that's paperwork that wasn't in the lawsuit papers The 1991 stuff is fascinatin' reading tho!

[styxfansite]

Does DDY still own any part of Styx what so ever?

[StyxCollector]

Does DDY still own any part of Styx what so ever?

My speculation based on events post-lawsuit settlement:
1. JY with Tommy as a minority own the name Styx
2. Due to DDY's profile, he can have use of the name Styx under certain conditions, but cannot perform AS Styx
3. DDY has to have some say in catalog matters that pertain to things he had involvment with, but I would guess JY and/or the label have final say

In a nutshell, they probably had to buy DDY off. DDY didn't relinquish his rights without getting something in return. I don't think they're touring just for income ...

[yogi]

What about Chuck & John??

Does Chuck own 2/5 intrest in the Styx name??

When you combine JY,Tommy & Chuck( because he does make appearances with Styx from time to time) you definately have controlling intrest so you can use the Styx name.


But what if you have Dennis, Tommy & Chuck now sharing the same stage. Do they now have controlling intrest???


Tell me about Yaz! I thought he was the guy who replaced Ted Williams in LF for the Sox.

Finally, If JY bought out everyone he must of been pretty damn good with his money. Or is that why he has to tour non stop. Make some money off the name that he owns???

[froy]

Tell me about Yaz!

You in love with this dude?

[kansas666]

What would happen if Dennis, Chuck, Tommy, Glen and Todd got together as a group to record new music and tour? They ask JY to join them, but he JY stays the bitter child and says no.

This whole premis is flawed. Why would JY refuse? It's all about money.

[DerriD]

What would happen if Dennis, Chuck, Tommy, Glen and Todd got together as a group to record new music and tour? They ask JY to join them, but he JY stays the bitter child and says no.

This whole premis is flawed. Why would JY refuse? It's all about money.

Dave,

Thanks for pointing out the obvious. Good point!

[sadie65]

Were it only based on money I would agree. It can be argued that the band with Dennis could have maintained it's same economic status (though of course given today's radio...doubtful). Certainly money is a great motivator...but I tend to think as savvy as JY may be when it comes to business...he isn't thinking that way where Dennis is concerned. I tend to think he would shut it down rather than allow it to continue...even if he were to be paid and reap some benefit from it. This is only my speculation, and nothing more.

Peace

[jimmy19029]

[I thought he was part of a new contract, but not as a huge partner as before. Just IMO, nothing more.[/quote]



Probably like in the group Chicago where Bill Champlin & Jason Scheff, who joined the group in the 80s, were brought into the company eventually. According to what I read they get a vote on some, but not all, issues. And, I'm sure, the lion's share of everything still goes to the four original guys left in the group.

[FormerDJMike]

Well, they could get around it and simply regroup and perform as "STICKS".

[jclrascal]

Interesting topic and though not likely to be a realistic scenario, it is intriguing to think about.

Kinda parallels a recent debate in the Black Sabbath camp. Evidently, there has been a recent decision made by founder/guitarist Tony Iommi to reform the Mk. II lineup with Geezer Butler and Bill Ward(both original Sabbath members) and bringing Ronnie James Dio back on lead vocals. This lineup wrote, recorded and toured behind the very successful 1980 album HEAVEN AND HELL as a comeback record after Ozzy left(or was fired, depending on who you believe) to go do the solo act.

This group reformed back in '92 for a second time to record a 3rd album together with the exception of MOB RULES drummer Vinnie Appice replacing Bill Ward on drums. This LP(DEHUMANIZER) was farily successful, too, but didn't have the same impact as 12 years before with HEAVEN AND HELL.

Since then, Sabbath has reformed with Ozzy and done tons of shows and made lots of money. But, they have not done a single new album with Ozzy(the last one was 1978 with NEVER SAY DIE) and only recorded a couple of new tracks they appeared on their comeback double live album released in 1998 called REUNION. So it's been 28 years since any original Sabbath material was written and released. As a reference, KILROY was released in 1983, so it's been "just" 23 years for Styx since they've released material by the definitive lineup.

Now, there is demand for a "Best Of" CD which features only the Ronnie James Dio material written on the 3 studio albums he did with Black Sabbath. It will be released before Christmas and the record company did ask he and Tony Iommi(which there has been a history of some bad blood between) to get together and write and record two new studio songs to add to the retrospective. It's a smart marketing idea to get the die hard fans to buy a new collection they already own most of the songs on anyway.

So, Tony and Ronnie got together back in the Spring and wrote and recorded the songs. Also, apparently, they decided to reform next Summer(2007) just to do a few shows over in Europe at some of the music festivals(probably about a dozen). It's not a full blown reunion with new album or extensive world tour, just a temporary get together to do a few shows.

Keep in mind that Tony has wanted to do a new studio album with Ozzy for about 10 years but Ozzy is less than motivated and his voice is pretty much shot(not to mention most of his creativity). Quite simply, Black Sabbath Mk. I(with Ozzy) is a dead horse right now. So, because many Sabbath fans consider the Mk II(with Dio) lineup to be musically superior, there has always been demand to see and hear that lineup write and record.

What's my point, you say?

Well, the debate is on whether to call the band "Black Sabbath" for these shows next summer. Tony Iommi owns the Sabbath name supposedly, so there is no legal reason not to do it. Rightfully so, they COULD ethically call themselves "Black Sabbath" as this lineup is the same one which was together in the early 1980's. It's not like the fans would be getting ripped off--which some Styx fans feel like ever since Dennis left the band.

Having said all of this, the 4 guys have evidently decided to refer to themselves on this tour simply as "Heaven and Hell" and NOT "Black Sabbath" purely for creative reasons. Because they'll ONLY be doing Sabbath songs written with Ronnie James Dio and not any Ozzy classics along with the fact that they are only doing it temporarily. They'll be listed on the bill as "Heaven and Hell" and not advertise themselves as "Black Sabbath".

Could a lineup with Dennis and Tommy(and whoever else) refer to themselves as either "Grand Illusion" or "Pieces of Eight" or maybe even "Equinox"???

I just saw quite a few similarities in the 2 situations, so I thought I'd let you guys know about this...

Respectfully,


Jack C. Lewis II