Interesting comment from Chuck on Dennis

[Zan]

I really thought a central theme of this book was forgiveness, growing & understanding. With that being said I cant believe that he wouldnt even consider talking to Dennis.

Oh *GAG*, Yogi.

And...how do you know he didn't even consider it? Tell me, please.

[Zan]

For Yogi, and anyone else who is remotely interested:

300,000-400,000 people in the U.S. suffer from MS.
950,000 people in the U.S. suffer HIV & AIDS.
1.1 million people every year in this country are diagnosed with some form of Cancer.
Hepatitis suffers in this country are >5,000,000
16,000,000 people in the U.S. have diabetes.

30,000 people in this country have ALS.

The death ratio of AIDS alone compared to that of ALS is at least 20 to 1 every year. This isn't including the deaths involved with cancer, hepatitis, diabetes, or MS.

From in investor standpoint, it not attractive to invest in. Plus, the clinical trials for ALS are more long and involved than most. Ei: more expensive - to save far fewer people.

Is it right? I guess that's a grey area. Is it practical? Maybe we're hitting a little closer to the mark.

Now please, just stop. Unless you want cough up $2,500,000 for one 18 month ALS clinical trial (which is the same cost as say, an MS trial), in which case, my husband's company would love to talk with you RIGHT AWAY.

[yogi]

The problem with what you are saying is we know what causes HIV:

1.Engaing in High Risk activity- Unprotected Sex, & sharing needles

We could completely eliminated HIV with education. Is it realistic....... No.... but we know what causes the HIV virus.

We cant say this about so many other diseases. We havent a clue what causes so many other horrible diseases. Why havent we funded these diseases as we have funded HIV/ Aids research. Why because these diseases dont have such a powerful political platform & voice as the gays & lesbians do.

[styxfansite]

For Yogi, and anyone else who is remotely interested:

300,000-400,000 people in the U.S. suffer from MS.
950,000 people in the U.S. suffer HIV & AIDS.
1.1 million people every year in this country are diagnosed with some form of Cancer.
Hepatitis suffers in this country are >5,000,000
16,000,000 people in the U.S. have diabetes.

30,000 people in this country have ALS.

The death ratio of AIDS alone compared to that of ALS is at least 20 to 1 every year. This isn't including the deaths involved with cancer, hepatitis, diabetes, or MS.

From in investor standpoint, it not attractive to invest in. Plus, the clinical trials for ALS are more long and involved than most. Ei: more expensive - to save far fewer people.

Is it right? I guess that's a grey area. Is it practical? Maybe we're hitting a little closer to the mark.

Now please, just stop. Unless you want cough up $2,500,000 for one 18 month ALS clinical trial (which is the same cost as say, an MS trial), in which case, my husband's company would love to talk with you RIGHT AWAY.

I would like to say that my father died of ALS in March. After seeing him lie in bed and suffer for 2 years, I think ALS needs alot more help.

[stabbim]

We cant say this about so many other diseases. We havent a clue what causes so many other horrible diseases. Why havent we funded these diseases as we have funded HIV/ Aids research. Why because these diseases dont have such a powerful political platform & voice as the gays & lesbians do.

Who is this "we" to which you keep referring? The government? The medical community? The voices in your head?

If your point is that you think there are diseases out there which deserve more attention than they get, by all means do what you can do get them that attention.

If your point is that you think there are diseases which get more attention than they deserve, then you need to step into the strike zone and take one for the team. You're wasting air that humans could be breathing.

[StyxCollector]

The problem with what you are saying is we know what causes HIV:

1.Engaing in High Risk activity- Unprotected Sex, & sharing needles

We could completely eliminated HIV with education. Is it realistic....... No.... but we know what causes the HIV virus.

We cant say this about so many other diseases. We havent a clue what causes so many other horrible diseases. Why havent we funded these diseases as we have funded HIV/ Aids research. Why because these diseases dont have such a powerful political platform & voice as the gays & lesbians do.

You're naive if you think education alone would eliminate HIV and AIDS. If it was that simple, why don't you think it hasn't been eradicated yet?

And hate to say it, plenty of non-homosexual human beings have HIV these days. It's not just considered something gays get - this isn't the 80s anymore.

Let me introduce you to a small continent named Africa ...

[StyxCollector]

I would like to say that my father died of ALS in March. After seeing him lie in bed and suffer for 2 years, I think ALS needs alot more help.

My grandfather died from Parkinsons 15 or so years ago. There's a fun one, let me tell you. I think we all have our encounters with these nasty, life sucking diseases in one way or another (family, friend, acquiantance). They are all important to research and find cures for.

[brywool]

I was a bit more dissapointed with JY's take. Geez, so what? If you want a book about Styx and not Chuck being gay in Styx, then write one yourself... or read Sterlings!

I'm about 100 pages into the book now (Chucks). I DO hope that there's more stuff on the band than more than the other stuff coming up, but it's a decent read.

[cinj]

And hate to say it, plenty of non-homosexual human beings have HIV these days. It's not just considered something gays get - this isn't the 80s anymore.

Let me introduce you to a small continent named Africa ...

Yes, but the REASON it's so rampant in Africa is because many poor individuals have a large number of sex partners.

I think his original point was that AIDS seems to get more attention and more money devoted to it proportionally to other killer diseases. I can see that if you or a loved one suffers from one of those dieseases, it can seem a bit unfair.

Of course, I think it's wonderful when ANY killer disease can generate donations and fund-raising to help find a cure.

I'd love to say something like "AIDS is for the most part a behavioral related disease", but I won't...because I'm sure I'll tick people off. It really disgusts me when you see all the celebraties on an MTV award show wearing their little red ribbons when a large group of them have music videos or are in movies where everyone is casually $#*%ing everyone else.

Sorry if I have offended,
Cinj

[styxfanNH]

What I find soo damn funny is that all through Chucks book( yea I read it, in the closet) he talks about not letting people in. How he tried to tackle everything by himself so not to burden others. Scared as hell how they would react to his situation. He states over and over how he regrets doing this. How he should of let those clse to him in.

How will he ever know what Dennis wanted. It could be that Dennis has read Chucks book, admires the shit out of his courage,apologize, or maybe he just wants to shake the hand of a once old friend.

It makes me really wonder who the close minded one is now??


As for me the most close minded people I have ever come across are those who are on a mission. Those who have found THEIR cause. Nothing else seems to matter anymore to most of them.

Why is it so hard to understand that there are events that happen between people that break all bonds of a friendship. Sometimes they are relationship (place your type of relationship here) ending for a lifetime. It's not close minded. It's simply a big enough event that it ended their relationship.

And don't forget the last person Dennis' manger reached out to was Glen to bring him into Dennis' fold. No reason to think that the olive branch could have been for the same thing. Especially with Dennis starting to put his new album together. Can you hear the whispers..... Chuck, I'm recording a new album. Let's burry the hatchet and play together like old times....

[Zan]

I would like to say that my father died of ALS in March. After seeing him lie in bed and suffer for 2 years, I think ALS needs alot more help.

There is no amount of condolances that will make yours or your father's suffering any less, and I agree that ALS is one nasty disease. My great uncle died from it as well. However, my point, which was directed at Yogi, was about the reality of the situation: Investors are mainly interested in investing their money when the potential gain is at its best. ALS, from an investment standpoint, is a waste of their time. They all want more bang for their buck, so to speak. They're taking the financial risk, they want to see the financial gain, period. This is what you have to deal with in the pharmaceutical world, sucky as it may be. It's ALL about business. It has very little to do with "special interest groups" at all and even less to do with helping people.

FYI, my husband has spent hours upon hours, 'til he was blue in the face trying to get an interest from the ALS Foundation and ALS Therapeutic Development Foundation with regard to the drugs his company was developing. He just wanted them to look into the reasearch his company had done & discoveries they'd made regarding treatments for the disease. No one could be bothered. They were not interested in learning anything new or potentially *gasp* helpful. There are a few reasons for this, he suspects, but regardless, the outcome is the same: They are ambivilent, and they're the ones in charge.

[Zan]

We could completely eliminated HIV with education. Is it realistic....... No.... but we know what causes the HIV virus.

The same way we are eliminating terrorism, drunk driving, drug addiction, teenage pregnancies, and child molestation with education? How much money has been/is being spent on educating the public on all of those things? How about HIV? Do we need to throw more money at the problem?

What I want to know is: How does knowing where a disease comes from help those who already have it, and why are they less worthy of treatment than someone who has something else? Because you think it's immoral?

We cant say this about so many other diseases. We havent a clue what causes so many other horrible diseases. Why havent we funded these diseases as we have funded HIV/ Aids research. Why because these diseases dont have such a powerful political platform & voice as the gays & lesbians do.

Um, no. These diseases are getting funded because their is a greater need for them to be funded. Ei: the numbers are far greater for these sufferers than other diseases (which I believe I already said). When the number of ALS sufferers reaches the number of HIV sufferers, then it might have more staying power. Right now, it's considered a waste of time in the business world. Sad, but true.

But as Stabbim said, feel free to make your voice heard on a more useful forum than a Styx message board, if it's that important to you. Maybe you can make real a difference.

[StyxCollector]

I think his original point was that AIDS seems to get more attention and more money devoted to it proportionally to other killer diseases. I can see that if you or a loved one suffers from one of those dieseases, it can seem a bit unfair.

Of course, I think it's wonderful when ANY killer disease can generate donations and fund-raising to help find a cure.

I'd love to say something like "AIDS is for the most part a behavioral related disease", but I won't...because I'm sure I'll tick people off. It really disgusts me when you see all the celebraties on an MTV award show wearing their little red ribbons when a large group of them have music videos or are in movies where everyone is casually $#*%ing everyone else.

Sorry if I have offended,
Cinj

YOu didn't offend me. As I said, my grandfather suffered from Parkinson's - horrible disease. He designed some of the lighting for the bridges in the NYC area, yet he couldn't talk, eat, or wipe his ass at the end. Sorry to be crass, but to see him suffer like that sucked. It still gives me nightmares. I'd love nothing mroe than to see a cure, but the numbers don't match the HIV/AIDS problem worldwide (including all gay and straight people affected). Look at all the good that someone like Michael J Fox does for Parkinson's.

And let's not even get into religion, where the use of condoms is considered a sin to some. So that would impede the efforts of this "education", no? HIV/AIDS is not just an education problem. You know it's bad to smoke, right? So why do people still do it? The education is out there. And sorry to say, it only takes one time of sleeping with someone to catch it. It has nothing to do with your number of partners. Get real.

Look, I think Bono can be a raging hard-on, but at least he puts his money where his mouth is and tries to raise awareness. He can't force you to do something for your favorite pet cause. If you feel strongly about something, get off your own ass and do something.

[Zan]

And hate to say it, plenty of non-homosexual human beings have HIV these days. It's not just considered something gays get - this isn't the 80s anymore.

Let me introduce you to a small continent named Africa ...

Yes, but the REASON it's so rampant in Africa is because many poor individuals have a large number of sex partners.

I think his original point was that AIDS seems to get more attention and more money devoted to it proportionally to other killer diseases. I can see that if you or a loved one suffers from one of those dieseases, it can seem a bit unfair.

Of course, I think it's wonderful when ANY killer disease can generate donations and fund-raising to help find a cure.

I'd love to say something like "AIDS is for the most part a behavioral related disease", but I won't...because I'm sure I'll tick people off. It really disgusts me when you see all the celebraties on an MTV award show wearing their little red ribbons when a large group of them have music videos or are in movies where everyone is casually $#*%ing everyone else.

First of all, just curious: how do you know who is f***ing "everyone" casually in the celebrity world to be making such rash judgements? Is this based on what you read in the tabloids?

I too can see why people who have watched loved ones suffer from any illness want to see that illness eradicated and not feel it's fair when other diseases are given more attention. I can ALSO see why an investor wouldn't want to be bothered pouring their money into a project that doesn't offer any real financial reward. If you were an investor, what would you do? And I don't mean a Bill Gates type, who has more money than he'll ever know what to do with. I mean someone who invests money and takes risks in the hopes that it will offer a substantial return. You gonna go with a cure for a disease that 30,000 people have, or one that over a million have? Which one's going to offer more of a profit when the drug is finally approved and released?

Like you said, it is nice that anyone is trying to cure anything these days (especially if you knew the amount of bullshit the FDA dishes out on a regular basis). But this is NOT a black and white issue, not by a long shot. It's first and foremost about the almighty dollar, and if it helps someone in the process, so be it - that's grand. But don't be fooled: Very few of these funds are coming from people who genuinely care about "the cause" itself. Even the ones who are supposedly in charge of the causes don't seem to be as motivated as one might think. Makes you wonder why, doesn't it?

It's all very depressing when you get right down to it. I could go on, I really could.

[cinj]

And sorry to say, it only takes one time of sleeping with someone to catch it. It has nothing to do with your number of partners. Get real.

Well, I would think that if you had sex with 100 "casual partners" the odds would go drastically up that you would be infected as opposed to, as you said, only sleeping with one partner casually.

I'm curious, why do YOU think this disease is so rampant in Africa? I'm only going by news stories that I've heard.

Cinj

[stabbim]

I'm curious, why do YOU think this disease is so rampant in Africa? I'm only going by news stories that I've heard.

Lack of education (and in some cases, really insidious disinformation), lack of funding, lack of technology, lack of a medical infrastructure worth half a damn, the list goes on.

It ain't because they're all about the reckless promiscuity.

[StyxCollector]

Well, I would think that if you had sex with 100 "casual partners" the odds would go drastically up that you would be infected as opposed to, as you said, only sleeping with one partner casually.

So what if someone you know is the person who has only slept with a handful of people. Not a slut or a dude, but not a saint. I think most of us fall into that category - we're just normal. That person sleeps with one partner who happens to have HIV and doesn't know it only once, and catches the disease. That's not really promiscuous. Poor judgment if a condom wasn't used et al., but it doesn't take sleeping with 100 people.

What if it was a virgin who slept with someone who had experience AND had HIV? Being promiscuous does increase the odds, but it's not exponential.

I'm curious, why do YOU think this disease is so rampant in Africa? I'm only going by news stories that I've heard.

Stabbim said it well. You always hear how hot the strip clubs and sex industry is in Montreal, yet you don't see them having benefits for AIDS victims there (not ones dedicated to it anyway) in the way you do for people in Africa. By your promiscuous logic, Montreal should have a higher rate of HIV/AIDS.

Sometimes 1+1 isn't 2. This is complex math

[rajah2165]

Near the end of this article... http://www.startribune.com/music/story/1205282.html

You know...Chuck should just keep his bigt trap shut. IF Dennis reached out to him, than it was a private thing.. But publicity hound Chuck wants to milk it...what people won't do to sell a few books...

[cinj]

Stabbim said it well. You always hear how hot the strip clubs and sex industry is in Montreal, yet you don't see them having benefits for AIDS victims there (not ones dedicated to it anyway) in the way you do for people in Africa. By your promiscuous logic, Montreal should have a higher rate of HIV/AIDS.

Sometimes 1+1 isn't 2. This is complex math

And I agree with his assessment. I still think multiple casual partners increases the odds. Now, maybe what I've read is wrong... I don't believe everything I read / see. But consider this from avert.org:

Why is HIV more widespread in Africa than elsewhere in the world, and why are some parts of Africa affected more than others?

No-one really knows the full answer to this question. However we do know there are many factors that influence the rate at which HIV is transmitted. Such factors include poverty; social instability; gender inequality; patterns of sexual networking (especially the prevalence of concurrent relationships); sexual violence; other sexually transmitted infections (which facilitate HIV transmission); lack of male circumcision; high mobility; rapid urbanisation and modernisation; and ineffective leadership during critical periods in the epidemic’s spread. Some scientists believe that differences between HIV subtypes also have an effect on transmission rates.

So based on this assessment, it seems it's a combination of things. Sadly, a very dangerous combination.
I hope we can agree to disagree.
Again, if I haven't offended - it feels like I have. Sorry.

[stabbim]

IF Dennis reached out to him, than it was a private thing..

Damn straight -- I always go through my manager to set up "private" meetings with former friends. It lends that personal touch that you just can't get any other way, y'know?

[StyxCollector]

IF Dennis reached out to him, than it was a private thing..

Damn straight -- I always go through my manager to set up "private" meetings with former friends. It lends that personal touch that you just can't get any other way, y'know?

Ha ... true to some extent.

But I still stand by my earlier statement - sometimes you use a third party to feel the other person out and warm them up to the idea. It's pretty clear Chuck didn't warm up to whatever DDY had to say.

We will never know, but it's sure fun to speculate

[stabbim]

We will never know, but it's sure fun to speculate

Ayup. Don't know, don't care. Just poking a little fun at some folks' attitudes.

[Ash]

IF Dennis reached out to him, than it was a private thing..

Damn straight -- I always go through my manager to set up "private" meetings with former friends. It lends that personal touch that you just can't get any other way, y'know?

Yeah - just ask Glen Burtnilk right? Isn't he performing with Dennis on many nights since Tim Orchard reached out to him?

Just curious.

It could have been a bridge building opportunity. Guess we'll never know.

[Zan]

IF Dennis reached out to him, than it was a private thing..

Damn straight -- I always go through my manager to set up "private" meetings with former friends. It lends that personal touch that you just can't get any other way, y'know?

Yeah - just ask Glen Burtnilk right? Isn't he performing with Dennis on many nights since Tim Orchard reached out to him?

Just curious.

Just curious...

What does that have to do with the cost of tea in China? Glen and Dennis were never friends, and that *was* a business arrangement, not a social "reaching out."

It could have been a bridge building opportunity. Guess we'll never know.

Or an opportunity to pull out the remainder of his hair and lose his sanity. And I guess he doesn't really care. Kinda the vibe I'm getting.

[Zan]

lack of male circumcision...

I'm sorry, but...WTF? Is that from a supposed "informative" website?

[rajah2165]

IF Dennis reached out to him, than it was a private thing..

Damn straight -- I always go through my manager to set up "private" meetings with former friends. It lends that personal touch that you just can't get any other way, y'know?

Yeah - just ask Glen Burtnilk right? Isn't he performing with Dennis on many nights since Tim Orchard reached out to him?

Just curious.

Just curious...

What does that have to do with the cost of tea in China? Glen and Dennis were never friends, and that *was* a business arrangement, not a social "reaching out."

It could have been a bridge building opportunity. Guess we'll never know.

Or an opportunity to pull out the remainder of his hair and lose his sanity. And I guess he doesn't really care. Kinda the vibe I'm getting.

Well Chuck is a no talent that rode Dennis's coat tails all the way to stardom (and lots of money) and now he doesn't even have the decency to acknowledge Dennis when Dennis reaches out to him... What a loser.

[Zan]

Well Chuck is a no talent that rode Dennis's coat tails all the way to stardom (and lots of money) and now he doesn't even have the decency to acknowledge Dennis when Dennis reaches out to him... What a loser.

OK, that's just plain funny.

First of all, it's: Dennis', not Dennis's. Second, Dennis found him to be talented enough back in 1962 when he asked to join their little group. Thirdly, Dennis didn't reach out to anybody, his manager did. If Dennis was a big enough man, he would have made the call himself, but as cowards do (you would know about that, wouldn't you, Rajah?), he hid behind the "coat tails" of his manager and had him make the "olive branch" call for him. At least Chuck takes responsibility for his own decisions. Fourth, what would you know about decency?

[blt man]

Finding out someone’s contact information and actually contacting that person are 2 different issues. I don’t see anything wrong with using a manager, secretary or assistant to do the former. If Dennis' manager had found out Chuck's contact information, at that point, I would expect Dennis to do the actual contacting on his own.

[styxfansite]

Finding out someone’s contact information and actually contacting that person are 2 different issues. I don’t see anything wrong with using a manager, secretary or assistant to do the former. If Dennis' manager had found out Chuck's contact information, at that point, I would expect Dennis to do the actual contacting on his own.

Here is something else to keep in mind and to think about DDY contacting Chuck through other sources. DDY's brother-in-law who's name is Chuck is CP's Cousin (may have something wrong there but I think it is right).

[Zan]

Finding out someone’s contact information and actually contacting that person are 2 different issues.

Another good point, thanks for making it.