brywool wrote:MOST of the songs date from Paradise Theatre and before that. Had Dennis not gone ballad-heavy, there'd still be a fully intact Styx (and yes, I would imagine that John might even be around because the band would never have fractured- could be wrong). After PT, Dennis's writing became increasingly syrup-heavy and dull.
No way Styx would have survived past the early 80s had they continued on the GI/Po8 track. Yes is another example. They were dead after Drama. They reinvented themselves with 90125. Rush got away from songs like Hemispheres and did MOving Pictures (and Neil wishes Perm. Waves was their 1st album). Say what you want, but what they did was a change, but a necessary one. Even if they had limited success, the change in music would have killed them or the increasing fractures in the band would have. There is no way Styx would have been fully intact by the mid 80s no matter what, and I bet we wouldn't even be talking about them today in the way we do now. Kitschy as it is, "Roboto" cemented Styx into pop culture forever.
It's not like TOmmy or JY were cranking out stellar material to better DDY - or a lot of rockers for that matter. Some of TS' work is not great until he cleaned up, and Ambition is proof of that. Some of it was good in that 1981 - 1986 time frame, but it was spotty at best.
Look at Journey - had Perry not gone all egotistical, ignored Herbie, and canned Smith and Valory, would they still be intact today? CUt me a fucking break. Same thing. Bands - and Rush is a rare exception - have about a 5 - 10 year span at their best, and break up or go on hiatus after that. The Stones have stopped being relevant years ago, but they tour on their hits and the cache of the name the Rolling Stones. Same could be said of McCartney for some, although his albums I find still pretty decent.
brywool wrote:If his are the only ones remembered, why has "Renegade" been their standard encore forever? Shouldn't it have been "Babe?". The fact is, the entire band (Jy too) contributed to what made Styx what they are. Dennis is what made Styx be watered down.
"Babe" was never the encore. Pretty much from 1978 on "Come Sail Away" was the show closer or the encore. There's a reason for that. "Renegade" also sometimes used to close a show. Never the encore until DDY was out of the band. "Midnight Ride" used to end their sets through 1978.
I could go on, but with current Styx, other than CSA, what "hit" do they have that's recognizable that could end a show? "Fooling Yourself" good song, lame closer. "Blue Collar Man" could work, but it'll be "Renegade" until ... well ... if DDY ever returns.
And I keep having to say this, but TS was just as soft as DDY back in the day. "She Cares"? "Sing For The Day"? "Boat on the River"? All decent songs, but far from rockers.
brywool wrote:I think up until Paradise Theatre, Dennis's stuff was great. Had he not gone so wussy after that album, I'd probably give Babe (not First Time) a bit more slack. But the fact is, he dove headlong into the Robert Gullet pool and has yet to emerge the rock guy that he was.
So you're saying his work on Cornerstone - which was "Babe" - was good, but he went sour with songs like "Rockin' the Paradise" and "Nothing Ever Goes As Planned"? OK. Yeah. Sure.
brywool wrote:Also, regarding Kilroy, I LOVED the concept of that album. I thought that generally, that idea was pretty cool. The pre-concert film was also cool and fun. What I didn't dig was that with that album, Styx nearly became a novelty act AND it broke them up. I'll never forget waiting for the premiere of their new tune on Mtv. When it was Mr. Roboto and they're dancing around in robot suits (probably not even them), I thought "What in the hell is this? Where's the guitar? Where's the POINT? Mr. Roboto? Who the f*ck knows what that is??".
Read/listen to my interview with DDY. It wasn't planned that way. "Roboto" tested well, A&M released it as a single, and boom, we are where we are.
brywool wrote:The fact is, it baffled record buyers. If you didn't know the concept, you were lost and so the album didn't do as well as the others had. It also was a VERY cheesy sounding record. "High Time" with those wimpy harmonies is just SO white. It's like listening to The Brady Six. THIS IS STYX?? There was no balls to that track or the album. Little kids shrieking after "Heavy Metal Poisoning"?? Seriously, how many of us could put that album on in a room of friends today and not have people walk out of the room? Not so "The Grand Illusion", "Eotc", or even "Styx II". KWH is a time capsule that's incredibly dated and corny. Just as DeYoung himself is. At least Styx (with Cyclo) tried to update their sound and I think they did it quite successfully. It's a pity that they took that momentum and did a covers album afterwards.
What, you wanted DDY - a white guy from the South Side of CHicago - to write R&B? I love Kilroy to this day, and yes, it has its moments where it is not GI, but there are some strong songs on there especially on side 2.
90125 is dated. Many albums from the 80s sound dated more because of the production than the songs. Raised on Radio sounds much more dated than Frontiers or Escape.
Cyclorama didn't sell well. It's not quite an update, but it's them in some ways trying to be something they thought they were. The best songs are the Glen or Gowan penned ones.
I suggest you take a listen to DDY's new solo album. It's his best work in quite a long time.
