OT - The headlines read these are the worst of times

by **LordofDaRing** » Fri Mar 20, 2009 6:05 am

...change that we can believe in! Looks like the love fest in D.C. is ending rather abruptly...

http://news.yahoo.com/s/politico/20209

by **KWH17** » Fri Mar 20, 2009 12:43 pm

It must be the worst of times when both the Republicans AND the Democrats are chewing out Obama's administration!

I really think the problems are coming from there simply being too much to deal with and the oversight that comes with that.

by **LordofDaRing** » Mon Mar 23, 2009 11:12 pm

Oh the love affair is definately over, check out the way Chris Todd has turned on the Administration. I love watching the national media scramble here, they don't know what to do. Maybe they will run another vital story on Sarah Palin's wardrobe. Is there anyone who doesn't think Barney Frank and Todd are the biggest slimeballs serving Washington today?

by **Blue Falcon** » Tue Mar 24, 2009 1:46 am

And it doesn't look like we got a "straight talkin', hard workin' son of a gun" in Obama, did we?

The only Hope that I have is that I still have some Change left in my pocket when Obama leaves office.

by **classicstyxfan** » Tue Mar 24, 2009 8:46 am

How can you judge the guy this early in his term ?....hes been in office all of 2 months now.........and he inherited one hell of a mess ! Yes, he's made a few mistakes, the special olympics comment was particularly embarrasing. The AIG bonus situation is also aggrivatiing. If things are not at least turning around as 2010 begins, then let him have it !

I sense the "I hope he fails" mentality out there which, considering the current state of things is hard for me to understand. If he fails, things are going to get pretty bad.

by **chowhall** » Tue Mar 24, 2009 9:13 am

classicstyxfan wrote:How can you judge the guy this early in his term ?....hes been in office all of 2 months now.........and he inherited one hell of a mess ! Yes, he's made a few mistakes, the special olympics comment was particularly embarrasing. The AIG bonus situation is also aggrivatiing. If things are not at least turning around as 2010 begins, then let him have it !

I sense the "I hope he fails" mentality out there which, considering the current state of things is hard for me to understand. If he fails, things are going to get pretty bad.

You can judge him on his Socialistic tendencies. So far, he's taken a bad situation and made it worse.

by **classicstyxfan** » Tue Mar 24, 2009 9:37 pm

so, in the event things do improve, I'm guessing none belonging to the Styx board right wing will be willing to give any of the credit to the President ?

It will be interesting to watch you all if we come out of this rather than plunging into a depression.

by **chowhall** » Tue Mar 24, 2009 11:59 pm

classicstyxfan wrote:so, in the event things do improve, I'm guessing none belonging to the Styx board right wing will be willing to give any of the credit to the President ?

It will be interesting to watch you all if we come out of this rather than plunging into a depression.

It'll be interesting if we don't end up just like the Carter years. The economy is not bad enough to put us into a depression. The housing market was overvalued and the sub prime mortgages are leaving quite a bit of indigestion for the banks. You tell me what interest rates will do as long as we seem to keep printing money like there is no tomorrow.

by **Ehwmatt** » Wed Mar 25, 2009 12:19 am

classicstyxfan wrote:How can you judge the guy this early in his term ?....hes been in office all of 2 months now.........and he inherited one hell of a mess ! Yes, he's made a few mistakes, the special olympics comment was particularly embarrasing. The AIG bonus situation is also aggrivatiing. If things are not at least turning around as 2010 begins, then let him have it !

I sense the "I hope he fails" mentality out there which, considering the current state of things is hard for me to understand. If he fails, things are going to get pretty bad.

The first 100 days of a presidency are often very telling. Or, at the least, the time when he is most influential. So far, that doesn't seem like much.

by **yogi** » Wed Mar 25, 2009 12:40 am

At least we all have free health care now.

I've got a huge stack of medical bills that I am about to send to Barack.

by **LordofDaRing** » Wed Mar 25, 2009 1:53 am

A couple of mistakes??

You know that joke about the Special Olympics and his giggle fit on 60 minutes are the least of this guy's problems. Keep in mind the mess this guy inherited, at least the economic one, is very much casued by him and his buddies Todd, Franke, Freddie and Fannie that has been well documented in several posts that have already been submitted here. This whole AIG fiasco is the biggest cluster of misguided hate and anger that I have ever seen in my life. Hey Mr. President, these guys have a contract. These idiots push through an 1,800 page stimulus package that nobody read. Nobody knows who (cough cough Chis Todd) put the AIG bonuses back in after they were removed, now these same morons are publically screaming about them. These AIG guys are now getting death threats and the President is threatening to introduce legislation to tax their bonuses at 90%??? I can see the lawyers lining up to sue the Federal Government on what has to be border line unconstituional legislation. The guy appointed a tax cheat to run the treasury and his other tax cheats (Dashle) had to resign before they got appointed. Not very patriotic huh Joe Biden? His printing money approach was tried under Jimmy Carter and it does/will have some short term turnaround, but what have we done to the future of this great country? Lets fact it, we elected a rock star, an image for a president. You get him away from the telepromtper and he falls apart, there is no substance behind this guy. Right now Nancy Pelosi and Barney Franke are running this country and that is even a scarier thought. As far a hoping he fails, what good does that do any of us. That is a weak argument in his defence. You are right, it has only been two months, that is scary too.

by **classicstyxfan** » Wed Mar 25, 2009 2:24 am

So, you are writing off the next 3 years and 10 months ? hell, I gave W a year before I said a negative word, and he ignored reports warning of potential terrorism on the US mainland ! I dont believe anything the Obama administration (sic ) has screwed up has risen to that level......at least not yet.

I dont know if this administration will be effective or not, but its too early to cast judgement in my opinion. It is possible they will learn from mistakes made, and its also possible they won't. we are 63 days into a 1,460 day term, but I guess they never had any chance with a lot of people. I liked what Meghan McCain had to say on CNN last night, I wish more repubs had her attitude.

oh, and thanks for the clarification regarding repubs not having anything to do with the situation we are now faced with.....too bad their 8 years in the oval office and 6 of those 8 with a majority in both houses of Congress. its a pity to learn they had no influince on the direction of the country. In that case, I guess W will go down as the most innefective prez in history.

by **LordofDaRing** » Wed Mar 25, 2009 3:14 am

So, you are writing off the next 3 years and 10 months ? hell, I gave W a year before I said a negative word, and he ignored reports warning of potential terrorism on the US mainland ! I dont believe anything the Obama administration (sic ) has screwed up has risen to that level......at least not yet.

Nope, just being honest as to what has transpired in the first couple of months. As far as any fault of 911 going to the Bush Admin, you really don't want to go there. How many chances did Clinton have at Bin Laden? Did he do anything after the first attack on the twin towers? How bout the Cole bombing? Clinton's over the top angry reaction to that question when asked by Chris Wallace and subsequent chewing out of his staff, speaks volumes on that. I am glad you gave Busj a year, that was a lot more than Nancy Pelosi and the democrats in congress did.

I did not watch what Meghan McCain had to say on CNN last night, but since I heard she is making the rounds on the View and CNN, I am sure it is all Bush's fault. I would give her as much attention as any other celeberty out there who claims to be an economics or foreign policy expert. She does not speak for all Republicans, and let me beat you to the punch, Rush doesn't either. Just like George Soros and Oprah do not speak for all Democrats. She probably falls right in with the rest of the political relatives, often more of an embarassment than anything else (Bush Twins, Billy Carter, Chelsea, Cheney's daughter, anybody with the last name Kennedy)

Oh any time on the clarification front. Think about it, "Failed Bush Policies", seems simple enough to sum up the Economic situation we are in. However, a failed liberal policy (Fair Housing Act) strong armed by Janet Reno over the banking industry led directly to Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac buying up all the defaulted loans. Furthermore, it was this President along with Barney and Chris that fought John McCain and George Bush tooth and nail on the regulation issues reagarding F&F. Follow the money trail my friend, the top 3 recipients of campaign money from F&F were BF, CT and BO. I believe BF called the half assed investigation of these executives a "witch hunt". At the beginning of that policy, the housing market had a huge boom, but as reality set in, the inevitabl defaults started.

No matter what Obama does, W will never go down in histroy as the most ineffective president. Jimmy Carter won that honor, by the way employing some of the same tactics that this president is tying to do.

by **ItsMyLife** » Wed Mar 25, 2009 3:15 am

I'm glad Obama is worried about filling out his NCAA bracket on ESPN and having dinner with Simon Cowell.

http://www.breitbart.tv/html/303843.html

Wow, was the American public hoodwinked by the media.

by **classicstyxfan** » Wed Mar 25, 2009 9:05 am

On MSNBC Live, Contessa Brewer stated, "Since Election Day, the Dow Jones industrial average has dropped nearly 3,000 points. It's shed a quarter of its value in just the past two months." But the Dow was on a downward trajectory months before the election, dropping 3,738 points from May 2, 2008, to November 3, 2008.

5/3/09 thru 11/2/09 down 26.5 percent

source: www.nvnews.net

The Dow opened at 8279.63 on 1/20/09.

The Dow closed at 7660.21 on 3/24/09 down 7.5 percent since Obama took office

seems like wall street has more confidence in Obama then they did in the Prevoius admiistration, dont you think........... ?

by **chowhall** » Wed Mar 25, 2009 10:22 am

classicstyxfan wrote:On MSNBC Live, Contessa Brewer stated, "Since Election Day, the Dow Jones industrial average has dropped nearly 3,000 points. It's shed a quarter of its value in just the past two months." But the Dow was on a downward trajectory months before the election, dropping 3,738 points from May 2, 2008, to November 3, 2008.

5/3/09 thru 11/2/09 down 26.5 percent

source: www.nvnews.net

The Dow opened at 8279.63 on 1/20/09.

The Dow closed at 7660.21 on 3/24/09 down 7.5 percent since Obama took office

seems like wall street has more confidence in Obama then they did in the Prevoius admiistration, dont you think........... ?

You know what they say about statistics. Or did you forget the Dow was down to 6500 last week?

by **classicstyxfan** » Wed Mar 25, 2009 11:32 am

just stating the facts as they exist today. If Dow goes down to 6500 and stays there, then the last laugh will be yours, if it continues to climb, it will belong to me.

I sure as hell hope it's the latter, but then, I dont want to see the country fail based on which party holds the oval office. My parents ability to retire depends on a rebound.

by **LordofDaRing** » Wed Mar 25, 2009 9:34 pm

"just stating the facts as they exist today. If Dow goes down to 6500 and stays there, then the last laugh will be yours, if it continues to climb, it will belong to me.

I sure as hell hope it's the latter, but then, I dont want to see the country fail based on which party holds the oval office. My parents ability to retire depends on a rebound."

I don't think he, I or you will be laughing if it stays there. Again, unlike some people, I want this guy to succeed, I will put my country's well being far above any partisan feelings. Document all the statistics you want during the Bush years, some of the same stats show that the country was headed to a recession when he was entering office too. Again I point to a failed liberal policy which eventually doomed the housing market and sent repercussions through the economy. Also point to another president who had to deal with a 911 and Hurricane Katrina during their administrations.

The company I work for now has a retention plan in place. Executive Management is excluded from this plan. If this guy gets his way, we could see this 90% tax passed on to retention plans all over hitting bonuses tied to every day working people (Engineers, welders, secretaries, etc). The Tax cheat running the Treasury Dept is asking for more oversight over major companies in our country. This idiot could not handle his own taxes, and now this. Obama seemed to get a little rattled at the CNN reporter last night. He wants Americans to work hard and take care of thier families? Now that is a novel idea.

by **Ehwmatt** » Wed Mar 25, 2009 10:43 pm

Geithner must resign, now.

by **Abitaman** » Thu Mar 26, 2009 12:58 am

I do not like politics, or to talk about them. I did not vote for our president.
BUT, he has only been office about 2 months. I have not ruled him out. I will wait about 6 months before I start to pass judgement. He is new to office and has a lot to learn. He is not the best speaker out there. But he seems to be riding a high so I can overlook the ESPN and speical olympic comments and such. He will have to tighten down and watch what he says. Given time he can become a better speaker. And given time we will see if he has a plan or not, and if the plan he has will work.
So I guess I really have no comment on our president right now.

by **Zan** » Thu Mar 26, 2009 2:56 am

Abitaman wrote:He is not the best speaker out there.

After the train wreck that just left office, he is a frickin' linguistic god.

by **classicstyxfan** » Thu Mar 26, 2009 3:00 am

LordofDaRing wrote:"just stating the facts as they exist today. If Dow goes down to 6500 and stays there, then the last laugh will be yours, if it continues to climb, it will belong to me.

I sure as hell hope it's the latter, but then, I dont want to see the country fail based on which party holds the oval office. My parents ability to retire depends on a rebound."
I don't think he, I or you will be laughing if it stays there. Again, unlike some people, I want this guy to succeed, I will put my country's well being far above any partisan feelings. Document all the statistics you want during the Bush years, some of the same stats show that the country was headed to a recession when he was entering office too. Again I point to a failed liberal policy which eventually doomed the housing market and sent repercussions through the economy. Also point to another president who had to deal with a 911 and Hurricane Katrina during their administrations.

The company I work for now has a retention plan in place. Executive Management is excluded from this plan. If this guy gets his way, we could see this 90% tax passed on to retention plans all over hitting bonuses tied to every day working people (Engineers, welders, secretaries, etc). The Tax cheat running the Treasury Dept is asking for more oversight over major companies in our country. This idiot could not handle his own taxes, and now this. Obama seemed to get a little rattled at the CNN reporter last night. He wants Americans to work hard and take care of thier families? Now that is a novel idea.

LODR, Im glad to hear you are rooting for success of the current administration, and I understand your opinion that their policies are the wrong way to get to the goal. I agree completely with Abitaman's post. I hope things turn around to the positive, if they do I will say a prayer of thanks ( and I will not say "i told you so" in any way shape or form. ) We are obvoiusly on different sides of the political fence, and since both parties policies have pros and cons we could thrust and parry continuously while debating which side is "right" I actually enjoy a good political discussion
and occasionally I have my mind changed on a topic. As long as we can keep it civil Im all for the dialogue.

by **LordofDaRing** » Thu Mar 26, 2009 3:20 am

"LODR, Im glad to hear you are rooting for success of the current administration, and I understand your opinion that their policies are the wrong way to get to the goal. I agree completely with Abitaman's post. I hope things turn around to the positive, if they do I will say a prayer of thanks ( and I will not say "i told you so" in any way shape or form. ) We are obvoiusly on different sides of the political fence, and since both parties policies have pros and cons we could thrust and parry continuously while debating which side is "right" I actually enjoy a good political discussion
and occasionally I have my mind changed on a topic. As long as we can keep it civil Im all for the dialogue."

We are in violent agreement Classic! We can always keep political discussions civil, afterall this isn't Dennis vs. Gowan is it

"After the train wreck that just left office, he is a frickin' linguistic god."

Yep, the teleprompter made a heck of a speech last night. Actually I disagree a bit with Abita Man on this, I think speaking is by far his strong suit. It might be his only one. Now that the election is over and we don't have to compare him with Sara Palin (wait wasn't she running for VP), lets be honest, what has this guy done prior to being elected. He has never never built a business, created real wealth or produced tangible prosperity. He is another Harvard guy who hangs out with celeberties. If the country really wants change, why don't we elect somebody who has actually lived and still lives a middle class existance. Lets face it, the presidential election is still a popularity contest, ala High School President, where we the public score on looks and debate points.

by **Rocker Chic** » Thu Mar 26, 2009 3:24 am

Abitaman wrote:I do not like politics, or to talk about them. I did not vote for our president.
BUT, he has only been office about 2 months. I have not ruled him out. I will wait about 6 months before I start to pass judgement. He is new to office and has a lot to learn. He is not the best speaker out there. But he seems to be riding a high so I can overlook the ESPN and speical olympic comments and such. He will have to tighten down and watch what he says. Given time he can become a better speaker. And given time we will see if he has a plan or not, and if the plan he has will work.
So I guess I really have no comment on our president right now.

I could care less about how good of a speaker a political figure is. The most important things to me are his/her actions and his/her ability to lead people to solutions that are beneficial to our country. A good speaker is certainly a plus, but I want to see, feel, and experience results. :evil:

Unfortunately, I'm more scared now than I was when we first entered this recession. :shock:

As someone I know recently wrote: "You can say nothing and have people wonder if you are stupid, or you can open your mouth and remove all doubt." We now have no doubt about a whole lot of public figures.

by **Zan** » Thu Mar 26, 2009 4:07 am

The teleprompter never helped Dubya.

by **classicstyxfan** » Thu Mar 26, 2009 4:27 am

I've got to say so far I am quite surprised by the Prez's proclivity to put his foot in his mouth ! I thought he was one to think before speaking.....evidently not necessasarily the case, is it ?

by **LordofDaRing** » Thu Mar 26, 2009 5:24 am

"The teleprompter never helped Dubya"

It might have hindered the flying shoes...

by **classicstyxfan** » Thu Mar 26, 2009 7:45 am

I was very impressed with Dubya's reflexes that day ! It would have bruised the USA's psyche if he had ended up with a " shoe shiner"
( groan..... :lol:

)

by **LordofDaRing** » Fri Mar 27, 2009 3:33 am

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/poli ... 2373.story

More reading material, if anyone has time....

by **styxfansite** » Mon Mar 30, 2009 11:07 pm

Hello my Commie friends, some breaking news for you :lol:

Obama fires GM's CEO

http://www.suntimes.com/news/politics/o ... 09.article

DETROIT---- Time and time again, General Motors Corp.'s board of directors reaffirmed its support for Chairman and CEO Rick Wagoner, even as the company piled up billions of dollars in losses and begged for government loans to stay alive.

But Wagoner is now a high-profile casualty of government intervention, forced out as part of the Obama administration's sweeping last-ditch effort to save the century-old auto giant.

Wagoner, 56, who spent 32 years with GM working all over the world, stepped down effective immediately, the company said in a statement early Monday. He was replaced as CEO by Fritz Henderson, the company's vice chairman and chief operating officer.

GM board member Kent Kresa, a former chairman and CEO of Northrop Grumman Corp., was named interim chairman and said new directors will make up the majority of GM's board when a new slate is nominated for election at the company's annual meeting in August.

"The board has recognized for some time that the company's restructuring will likely cause a significant change in the stockholders of the company and create the need for new directors with additional skills and experience," Kresa said in a written statement.

GM shares tumbled 86 cents, or 24 percent, to $2.76 in premarket trading Monday. That is down 89 percent from its 52-week high of $24.24 on April 30, 2008.

The management shake-up, according to several industry analysts, shows that the administration is serious about forcing GM to change more quickly and dramatically than it did during Wagoner's nearly nine-year tenure as CEO.

Jeremy Anwyl, chief executive of the automotive Web site Edmunds.com, called the move "political theater" to appease an increasingly bailout-weary public.

"American taxpayers are not happy," Anwyl said. "But this way you're able to point to Rick and say he's gone, and that creates an environment where the loans become politically palatable."

By all accounts, Wagoner made progress in fixing GM. While CEO, he cut its U.S. work force from 177,000 to roughly 92,000 today.

Wagoner also closed factories; shed the unprofitable Oldsmobile brand; globalized GM's engineering, manufacturing and design to save billions; and led a resurgence in quality and performance of its long-neglected cars. In 2007, the company reached a landmark agreement with the United Auto Workers that shifted massive retiree health care costs to a union-run trust and ushered in a $14-per-hour wage for new hires, about half that of a current laborer.

But critics, including many members of Congress, say Wagoner moved too slowly, failing to cut enough of the company's huge health care and pension costs, and relying too long on high-profit pickup trucks and SUVs as gas prices rose and the market shifted toward smaller vehicles.

In the past four years, GM has piled up $82 billion in losses.

Still, Wagoner had the company moving in the right direction, Anwyl said.

"Was he moving fast enough or bold enough? Obviously, in light of what we know today," Anwyl said, "the answer would be no."

While ousting Wagoner, the Obama administration made no management changes at Chrysler LLC, which also is getting government loans. Chairman and CEO Robert Nardelli has only been in charge there since August 2007.

David Cole, chairman of the Center for Automotive Research in Ann Arbor, Mich., said Wagoner's departure probably will have little impact on GM's restructuring efforts because Henderson was the heir-apparent in GM's succession plans.

"I don't think you would see any shift or significant change at all with Rick's leaving. I think the course that they're on, they're on," he said.

Wagoner became GM's face to the public during a disastrous November appearance before Congress to request assistance. He was lampooned on NBC's Saturday Night Live after being torn apart by lawmakers for flying to Washington in a corporate jet and offering vague, rambling answers to their questions.

"Given the history, a change in management could hardly hurt and might do some good," Sen. Charles Schumer, D-N.Y., said Sunday.

Wagoner's ouster came just before President Barack Obama planned to announce what Chrysler and GM must do to get government loans beyond the $17.4 billion they have already received.

Several senior administration officials said GM will get enough government aid to restructure over the next 60 days, while Chrysler will get up to $6 billion and 30 days to complete an alliance with Italian automaker Fiat SpA. If Chrysler fails to reach a deal with Fiat or another partner, the government won't provide any further financing, likely sending the company into liquidation.

The officials spoke on condition of anonymity because they were not authorized to make the details public.

Wagoner, a former Duke University basketball player, joined GM in 1977, serving in several capacities in the U.S., Brazil and Europe. He became president and chief executive in 2000 and has served as chairman and CEO since May 2003.

In a December interview with The Associated Press, he declined to speculate on suggestions that he step down.

"I'm doing what I do because it adds a lot of value to the company," Wagoner said. "It's not clear to me that experience in this industry should be viewed as a negative, but I'm going to do what's right for the company and I'll do it in consultation with the (GM) board (of directors)."

Wagoner isn't the first CEO to lose his job as part of a government bailout. The CEOs of mortgage giants Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac were forced out after the government took over the companies in the fall. Robert Willumstad, the former CEO of American International Group Inc., left the company in September.

GM cannot make severance payments to Wagoner or other senior executives under the terms of its governments loans. The company said in its annual report this month that Wagoner is eligible to retire under GM's salaried employee and executive retirement plans, but the amount he would receive was unclear.

GM and Chrysler were required by the Bush administration to get major concessions from debtholders and the United Auto Workers, with a deadline of March 31 for signed contracts. But very little headway was made in the negotiations this weekend as the parties awaited Obama's announcement.

Wagoner said in a statement early Monday that he was asked to "step aside" during a meeting with Obama administration officials on Friday, and he consented.

He called Henderson an excellent choice to lead the company and thanked employees around the world.

"GM is a great company with a storied history," he said. "Ignore the doubters because I know it is also a company with a great future."

Copyright 2009 Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten, or redistributed.

Can't wait to see what Glen Beck has to say about this.

MR

OT - The headlines read these are the worst of times

OT - The headlines read these are the worst of times

Obama fires GM's CEO

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