Illegal Immigration in USA: WTF Is There To Argue About?

[slucero]

Pony up or get the fuck outta here.

Could you please tell the illegal immigrants the same thing!

No he won't. The libs want them as votes, it's that fucking simple. The day this country passes a law making it required to show ID to vote..the libs lose and they know it.

LOL, righhht. The day the Finance Reform Bill passes, you assholes are fucked. Care to explain that one Dicknose?

I am in favour of ID cards, but you needledicks will probably bitch about the cost to produce them.

More likely... within months of Finance reform passing, market makers like the banks take the DOW down... just like they did in 30's...

[ohsherrie]

If I knew a pathological murder that fit my description was being sought in this area I'd be damned glad to prove my identity to help Law Enforcement narrow the field.

That is not the same thing, that would be a one-time event whereas this bill makes it so Latinos have to constantly prove their legality again and again. They don't get to prove their citizenship once and be done with it like in your scenario, they're going to have to pull out papers every time an authority figure sees fit. It's easy for you to shrug because you're white and have never been discriminated against by your country because of it, but minorities face discrimination every day and are usually treated as "guilty until proven innocent" by law enforcement, and to make it legal to harass LEGAL Latinos is embarrassing for a country that claims to be one of tolerance and equal opportunity. And what will this law accomplish? Some illegals will be caught. More will come in through loopholes in the system. Meanwhile America is harassing its own citizens on a daily basis and breeding hatred for anyone with brown skin.

I think if you were being harassed every day by cops and neighbors alike you would be up in arms about your rights as a citizen.

This bill is the wrong way to go about solving illegal immigration.

Like I said in one of my other sentences that you chose to ignore, if they're citizens they should be proud to show it. The only reason I can think of that would make somebody afraid or resentful of showing their credentials is if they're afraid of being caught for something.

Like I said in another sentence that you chose to ignore, that's a small price to pay for the safety of the CITIZENS of this country. If you're not a citizen then you should be afraid, very afraid. If you're not, Homeland security isn't doing their job.

How would you solve the problem of illegal immigration?

The way I would do it is to let every citizen know they need to carry proof of citizenship and allow a reasonable period for CITIZENS to do so. Then ID people at every opportunity and if they can't prove their citizenship within a reasonable period of time (hours, not days) send them back to where they came from. If they gave birth to a child here so they could get into our social programs give them a choice of; a) taking a citizenship test within a month of their arrest b)taking their child back where they came from c)leaving their child here to be adopted by a legal citizen of this country. No exceptions for any reason medical or otherwise.

You have to draw the line somewhere and a blurry, grey line is as good as none.

[Saint John]

If I knew a pathological murder that fit my description was being sought in this area I'd be damned glad to prove my identity to help Law Enforcement narrow the field.

That is not the same thing, that would be a one-time event whereas this bill makes it so Latinos have to constantly prove their legality again and again. They don't get to prove their citizenship once and be done with it like in your scenario, they're going to have to pull out papers every time an authority figure sees fit. It's easy for you to shrug because you're white and have never been discriminated against by your country because of it, but minorities face discrimination every day and are usually treated as "guilty until proven innocent" by law enforcement, and to make it legal to harass LEGAL Latinos is embarrassing for a country that claims to be one of tolerance and equal opportunity. And what will this law accomplish? Some illegals will be caught. More will come in through loopholes in the system. Meanwhile America is harassing its own citizens on a daily basis and breeding hatred for anyone with brown skin.

I think if you were being harassed every day by cops and neighbors alike you would be up in arms about your rights as a citizen.

This bill is the wrong way to go about solving illegal immigration.

Like I said in one of my other sentences that you chose to ignore, if they're citizens they should be proud to show it. The only reason I can think of that would make somebody afraid or resentful of showing their credentials is if they're afraid of being caught for something.

Like I said in another sentence that you chose to ignore, that's a small price to pay for the safety of the CITIZENS of this country. If you're not a citizen then you should be afraid, very afraid. If you're not, Homeland security isn't doing their job.

How would you solve the problem of illegal immigration?

The way I would do it is to let every citizen know they need to carry proof of citizenship and allow a reasonable period for CITIZENS to do so. Then ID people at every opportunity and if they can't prove their citizenship within a reasonable period of time (hours, not days) send them back to where they came from. If they gave birth to a child here so they could get into our social programs give them a choice of; a) taking a citizenship test within a month of their arrest b)taking their child back where they came from c)leaving their child here to be adopted by a legal citizen of this country. No exceptions for any reason medical or otherwise.

You have to draw the line somewhere and a blurry, grey line is as good as none.

Agreed. It's just like being carded when you go into a bar. I don't fucking moan and complain. I show my ID and enter legally. Same concept.

[squirt1]

Laws need to be obeyed !!!! Period. Congress MUST stop interfering with the enforcement of laws.This is a form of buying votes by saying look what we did for you. Look at all the states/hospitals that are being bankrupted by illegals getting benefits. I am sad to see that states have to defend themselves when it is the job of the Feds. Some of these guys are gang members/drug runners armed better than the local police. Washington is full of worms looking out for themselves. They ALL need to go. I can't wait for November ! Loved your post OhSherrie. Where have you been?

[rsimpson]

Congress MUST stop interfering with the enforcement of laws

Got news for you (and everyone else). This will be struck down. States are not legally allowed to dictate Foreign Policy. It up to Congress to come up with the laws.

[slucero]

... the laws already exist.... the Feds aren't enforcing them...

The Arizona law will a force a SCOTUS review... and the Feds will be made to look bad... then the states will sue...

[SherriBerry]

Pony up or get the fuck outta here.

Could you please tell the illegal immigrants the same thing!

No he won't. The libs want them as votes, it's that fucking simple. The day this country passes a law making it required to show ID to vote..the libs lose and they know it.

You don't have to show ID when you are at a voting station? Don't you have to be previously registered to vote and prove you are who you say you are when you go to your designated polling station? Every time I vote, I have to bring photo ID to prove I am the registered voter on the list. Geez, I had to bring photo ID to my final exams at university. Does that mean I can go to the US, show up at a polling station, and vote for whoever I want?

That reminds me, I recently moved and have to update my voter registration to this district.

[Michigan Girl]

Pony up or get the fuck outta here.

Could you please tell the illegal immigrants the same thing!

No he won't. The libs want them as votes, it's that fucking simple. The day this country passes a law making it required to show ID to vote..the libs lose and they know it.

You don't have to show ID when you are at a voting station? Don't you have to be previously registered to vote and prove you are who you say you are when you go to your designated polling station? Every time I vote, I have to bring photo ID to prove I am the registered voter on the list. Geez, I had to bring photo ID to my final exams at university. Does that mean I can go to the US, show up at a polling station, and vote for whoever I want?

That reminds me, I recently moved and have to update my voter registration to this district.

I have to show ID to vote ...

[Jana]

Pony up or get the fuck outta here.

Could you please tell the illegal immigrants the same thing!

No he won't. The libs want them as votes, it's that fucking simple. The day this country passes a law making it required to show ID to vote..the libs lose and they know it.

You don't have to show ID when you are at a voting station? Don't you have to be previously registered to vote and prove you are who you say you are when you go to your designated polling station? Every time I vote, I have to bring photo ID to prove I am the registered voter on the list. Geez, I had to bring photo ID to my final exams at university. Does that mean I can go to the US, show up at a polling station, and vote for whoever I want?

That reminds me, I recently moved and have to update my voter registration to this district.

of course, you do. FactFinder isn't stating facts.

[rsimpson]

Pony up or get the fuck outta here.

Could you please tell the illegal immigrants the same thing!

No he won't. The libs want them as votes, it's that fucking simple. The day this country passes a law making it required to show ID to vote..the libs lose and they know it.

You don't have to show ID when you are at a voting station? Don't you have to be previously registered to vote and prove you are who you say you are when you go to your designated polling station? Every time I vote, I have to bring photo ID to prove I am the registered voter on the list. Geez, I had to bring photo ID to my final exams at university. Does that mean I can go to the US, show up at a polling station, and vote for whoever I want?

That reminds me, I recently moved and have to update my voter registration to this district.

Different states have different requirements. Some only require it when voting for the first time. Others only require it when you register

[AlteredDNA]

Pony up or get the fuck outta here.

Could you please tell the illegal immigrants the same thing!

No he won't. The libs want them as votes, it's that fucking simple. The day this country passes a law making it required to show ID to vote..the libs lose and they know it.

You don't have to show ID when you are at a voting station? Don't you have to be previously registered to vote and prove you are who you say you are when you go to your designated polling station? Every time I vote, I have to bring photo ID to prove I am the registered voter on the list. Geez, I had to bring photo ID to my final exams at university. Does that mean I can go to the US, show up at a polling station, and vote for whoever I want?

That reminds me, I recently moved and have to update my voter registration to this district.

Different states have different requirements. Some only require it when voting for the first time. Others only require it when you register

http://www.ehow.com/about_5375741_state ... -vote.html

Which States Require a Photo ID to Vote?

Laws that require photo identification at the voting booth are becoming more common across the country. With the new laws come criticism that conservative lawmakers are trying to prevent low-income voters from showing up at the polls.

States requiring photo ID
Seven states have enacted voter identification laws that require or request certain forms of photo identification from voters. They are Florida, Georgia, Hawaii, Indiana, Louisiana, Michigan and South Dakota, according to the National Conference of State Legislatures. Some of these states' laws are more strict than others.

Why do they require photo ID?
Lawmakers in these states enacted photo identification laws for voters in an effort to prevent fraud at the polls. Requiring people to present photo ID makes it easier to keep track of who has voted and make sure the person voting is who they say they are. Lawmakers have also pointed to illegal immigration to support the requirement that voters show identification that can only be obtained by U.S. citizens.

No ID?
A voter who tries to cast a ballot without proper photo identification in Georgia will be given a provisional ballot. That voter then has two days to present proper identification at the county registrar's office, according to the National Conference of State Legislatures, or the ballot will be tossed.

Florida, Louisiana, Michigan and South Dakota allow voters to fill out an affidavit swearing to their identity. Hawaii asks voters with no identification to recite their date of birth and address of residence to verify information in the polling books. Indiana offers provisional ballots and gives voters until the following Monday to provide photo ID or fill out an affidavit swearing that the voter is indigent and unable to obtain photo ID.

Criticism
Critics of these laws say they are designed to disenfranchise low-income voters who don't have proper identification. Though many of these laws offer exemptions for people who can't obtain identification, critics point out that the process of obtaining an ID is burdensome. Potential voters who lack ID might simply decide not to vote rather than deal with the hassle.

They also point out that much of the alleged voter fraud that the laws are designed to protect against is anecdotal. They argue that Indiana, for example, has no recorded cases of anyone committing voting fraud in person at the polls.

Legal challenges
Laws requiring photo identification have been subject to myriad legal challenges, according to the National Conference of State Legislatures. Indiana's law was challenged all the way up to the U.S. Supreme Court, which upheld the law in a ruling in April 2008. Michigan's law was upheld by the Michigan Supreme Court in 2007. An injunction against Georgia's law was upheld by the 11th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals in 2006. A federal judge reinstated the law in 2007.

A photo identification law for voters in Missouri was struck down by the Missouri State Supreme Court in 2006. Missouri still requires identification, but the acceptable forms of ID are now broader and include forms without a photograph.

[Michigan Girl]

States requiring photo ID
Seven states have enacted voter identification laws that require or request certain forms of photo identification from voters. They are Florida, Georgia, Hawaii, Indiana, Louisiana, Michigan and South Dakota, according to the National Conference of State Legislatures. Some of these states' laws are more strict than others.

Thanks, DNA ...^^^this explains why I thought this law was already in place!! Who knew the other states
were so stupid?!?! Learn something new every day!!

This also explains Jana's ignorance (ha ha) ..."of course you do!!!" ...

[Sarah]

If I knew a pathological murder that fit my description was being sought in this area I'd be damned glad to prove my identity to help Law Enforcement narrow the field.

That is not the same thing, that would be a one-time event whereas this bill makes it so Latinos have to constantly prove their legality again and again. They don't get to prove their citizenship once and be done with it like in your scenario, they're going to have to pull out papers every time an authority figure sees fit. It's easy for you to shrug because you're white and have never been discriminated against by your country because of it, but minorities face discrimination every day and are usually treated as "guilty until proven innocent" by law enforcement, and to make it legal to harass LEGAL Latinos is embarrassing for a country that claims to be one of tolerance and equal opportunity. And what will this law accomplish? Some illegals will be caught. More will come in through loopholes in the system. Meanwhile America is harassing its own citizens on a daily basis and breeding hatred for anyone with brown skin.

I think if you were being harassed every day by cops and neighbors alike you would be up in arms about your rights as a citizen.

This bill is the wrong way to go about solving illegal immigration.

Like I said in one of my other sentences that you chose to ignore, if they're citizens they should be proud to show it. The only reason I can think of that would make somebody afraid or resentful of showing their credentials is if they're afraid of being caught for something.

Like I said in another sentence that you chose to ignore, that's a small price to pay for the safety of the CITIZENS of this country. If you're not a citizen then you should be afraid, very afraid. If you're not, Homeland security isn't doing their job.

How would you solve the problem of illegal immigration?

The way I would do it is to let every citizen know they need to carry proof of citizenship and allow a reasonable period for CITIZENS to do so. Then ID people at every opportunity and if they can't prove their citizenship within a reasonable period of time (hours, not days) send them back to where they came from. If they gave birth to a child here so they could get into our social programs give them a choice of; a) taking a citizenship test within a month of their arrest b)taking their child back where they came from c)leaving their child here to be adopted by a legal citizen of this country. No exceptions for any reason medical or otherwise.

You have to draw the line somewhere and a blurry, grey line is as good as none.

Soooo you would be ok if the government said that all white citizens had to carry a passport on their person at all times for the forseeable future or face jail?

I already said that IMO the biggest step to solving illegal immigration is to crack down on companies hiring illegals, and do stricter checks on people getting welfare, if that truly is a problem. Seriously, this law is going to do nothing but breed suspicion and hatred for brown people. They will always find a way to come back to America if there is work to be had from unscrupulous companies.

I'll step out of this thread now. Next step in your line of thinking is internment camps until the problem is solved, much like the Japanese endured in WWII. Thought our country had learned its lesson from that.

[Lula]

i laugh at those that insist this law is not racial profiling.

i understand the frustration with immigration. when reagan provided amnesty it was suppose to help the situation. nothing has changed. the laws that are on the books are still not being enforced. employers need to be held accountable for hiring persons that are not cleared to work in this country.

so how about all the native americans with brown skin? are they going to be asked to show their papers? what about the euros with white skin? will they be questioned? welcome to germany, nazi ( )era, "can i see your papers?" this law is a disgrace!

[Saint John]

i laugh at those that insist this law is not racial profiling.

It is ... and it should be. When 90% of the illegals are a certain race, common sense mandates that you ... profile that race! Looking for red-headed Irish people really wouldn't do any good now would it?

so how about all the native americans with brown skin? are they going to be asked to show their papers? what about the euros with white skin? will they be questioned? welcome to germany, natzi era, "can i see your papers?" this law is a disgrace!

It's "Nazi." And it's already the law to carry ID, or you're considered a vagrant and can be detained. So this is really nothing more than semantics. I'd show my ID every single fucking day to rid our country of these filthy fuckers that have destroyed the core of the country. They kill 25+ people every day. You liberals belly ache about every single fucking thing that would help this country, and when you cross the border illegally you're a fucking criminal and should be jailed or deported and never allowed back. Personally, I'd like to see them jailed for a minimum of 10 years for a first offense and executed if caught twice. Give these fuckers 12 months to vacate the country and start this whole process over, but Dems would never go for that because they'd see nothing more than certain votes exiting the country.

[jrnyman28]

There was an article today stating there is already a noticeable affect in the day labor circles due to this law. Fewer people stopping, and many "day laborers" are already planning to move outta state. Sounds great to me! One woman has been living illegally in AZ for TEN years and is now hoping for a miracle so she can stay!?!?!? In TEN YEARS she couldn't become a LEGAL resident???

[Lula]

major faus pas on my spelling error, lol

racial profiling is illegal in this country. having to show id is one thing and proving legal status is another. i am not saying it is okay for anyone to get away with with a crime. as it stands, the law in arizona is an embarrassment to this country's history, greatness, and tolerance. it is up to the federal govenment to handle this (immigration issues) and they have gragged their feet for 30 plus years.

"they kill 25+ people every day" what???

[7 Wishes]

The problem is that many U.S. corporations now rely on the labour of illegal immigrants in order to maintain financial solvency.

It's a mess.

[RedWingFan]

Seriously...who thinks this is a bad thing? Job openings swarmed upon by American citizens. Go figure.

http://www.azfamily.com/news/Hundreds-s ... 80224.html

by Dan Neligh

PHOENIX -- Job hunters turned out in the hundreds to fill recently-vacant positions at Pro's Ranch Market stores, where a federal audit led to the firing of some 300 workers.

Roxanne Nieves, one of the many that came out in search of a job, said she came to apply after she heard about the layoffs.

"We heard they are firing a lot of illegal people, so we're here to apply," she said.

Nonetheless, she and many others felt guilty about taking the jobs of the people who had just been fired.

"To me, it's pretty hard to see everybody losing jobs," one job hunter said.

About 300 of the 1,500 total employees at the six Phoenix supermarkets were let go this week after an Immigration and Customs Enforcement audit found them to be working illegally.

Attorney Julie Pace said the company has I-9 forms on everyone and uses E-Verify to check employees' eligibility to work, but that is not always enough.

"The company wouldn't know if someone is using counterfeit documents," Pace said.

Pace also called on the federal government to help companies comply with hiring laws.

"We need an easy program for employers to use to hire people -- safe, easy, quick -- so we don't have to deal with ICE audits," she said.

Pro's Ranch Market is among some 1,600 U.S. businesses, including 84 in Arizona, that have undergone ICE audits since July 2009.

ICE says the goal is to reduce demand for illegal employment and protect job opportunities for the nation's lawful workforce.

[jrnyman28]

I had to file an I-9 for one of my jobs last month.

[RedWingFan]

I had to file an I-9 for one of my jobs last month.

All I know is that chick in your sig is hot as hell!

[L~L~L]

Great read.

Racist Myths about Mexican Immigrants
http://academic.udayton.edu/race/02rights/guadalu4.htm

[Saint John]

Great read.

Racist Myths about Mexican Immigrants
http://academic.udayton.edu/race/02rights/guadalu4.htm

Total shit. Listen, I don't give a fuck what happened in the past, regarding Mexico and California. This country has laws and they have to be obeyed. Why don't you try explaining to the families of the 25+ people killed each day by illegals what President Polk did and see what they think.

[steveo777]

Great read.

Racist Myths about Mexican Immigrants
http://academic.udayton.edu/race/02rights/guadalu4.htm

Oh really?

http://www.city-journal.org/html/14_1_t ... alien.html

The Illegal-Alien Crime Wave
Heather Mac Donald


Some of the most violent criminals at large today are illegal aliens. Yet in cities where the crime these aliens commit is highest, the police cannot use the most obvious tool to apprehend them: their immigration status. In Los Angeles, for example, dozens of members of a ruthless Salvadoran prison gang have sneaked back into town after having been deported for such crimes as murder, assault with a deadly weapon, and drug trafficking. Police officers know who they are and know that their mere presence in the country is a felony. Yet should a cop arrest an illegal gangbanger for felonious reentry, it is he who will be treated as a criminal, for violating the LAPD’s rule against enforcing immigration law.

I don't understand why so many people have so much sympathy for these lawbreakers here. There are solutions but it's gonna take some tough, draconian moves to make a difference. Most people don't have the spine for it. America has become pussified!

[L~L~L]

LOL, I'm merely stating who the first criminal was. I don't need to explain anything to anyone, people die every damn day (it is sad but true) and not only at the hands of illegals but citizens as well. The Mexicans aren't the only illegals here they come from all over the world! This law is simply racial profiling no more no less. I would hate to go through my whole life having to prove who the hell I am just cause I looked Mexican/Hispanic/Latino or just simply brown (Jersey shore better watch out, Oh wait they are orange.

If it is about illegals paying taxes then you got it all wrong by going after the them. The Employer is to be held accountable he is the one committing a crime not only by hiring but also withholding wages and not reporting them. The alien is simply trying to survive not a damn thing wrong with that at least they are working for the money and not asking for a handout! Listen argue all you want at the end you nor I will take a damn thing to our grave.

[steveo777]

Hey, I think I figured out what the illegals / sex crimes correlation is.

From Wiki:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ages_of_co ... th_America

In Mexico, criminal legislation is shared between the federal and state governments. The federal law establishes the age of 12 as the minimum age of consent, while the age at which there are no restrictions for consensual sexual activities is 18 (sex with children 12-18 is not illegal per se, but can still be open to prosecution under certain circumstances). Local state laws may override the federal law. In practice , the decision as to whether or not to prosecute is left to state authorities regardless of the younger person's age. At state level, the minimum ages of consent vary between 12 (and puberty in a few states) and 15, while the age at which there are no restrictions for consensual sexual activities vary from 16 to 18 (most common 18).

So, apparently some of these guys come over here thinking it's ok to have sex with 13 year old girls.

[Rockindeano]

I don't understand why so many people have so much sympathy for these lawbreakers here. There are solutions but it's gonna take some tough, draconian moves to make a difference. Most people don't have the spine for it. America has become pussified!

No one here is granting an ounce of sympathy to any 'lawbreaker.' Our point is that many people, brown folk, who are in fact American or here awaiting citizenship, are not criminals. You just made our point about this bullshit law. It's a racist law, and one without thought or understanding. No one here has stood in opposition to immigration reform....just the way it's being dealt with by the state of Arizona and soon to be Texas. hell, even Karl Rove and Lindsay Grahm are saying this isn't constitutional. That should tell you something.

[Ehwmatt]

I don't understand why so many people have so much sympathy for these lawbreakers here. There are solutions but it's gonna take some tough, draconian moves to make a difference. Most people don't have the spine for it. America has become pussified!

No one here is granting an ounce of sympathy to any 'lawbreaker.' Our point is that many people, brown folk, who are in fact American or here awaiting citizenship, are not criminals. You just made our point about this bullshit law. It's a racist law, and one without thought or understanding. No one here has stood in opposition to immigration reform....just the way it's being dealt with by the state of Arizona and soon to be Texas. hell, even Karl Rove and Lindsay Grahm are saying this isn't constitutional. That should tell you something.

I'm not biased against Mexicans. I love Mexican food.

[Behshad]

I don't understand why so many people have so much sympathy for these lawbreakers here. There are solutions but it's gonna take some tough, draconian moves to make a difference. Most people don't have the spine for it. America has become pussified!

No one here is granting an ounce of sympathy to any 'lawbreaker.' Our point is that many people, brown folk, who are in fact American or here awaiting citizenship, are not criminals. You just made our point about this bullshit law. It's a racist law, and one without thought or understanding. No one here has stood in opposition to immigration reform....just the way it's being dealt with by the state of Arizona and soon to be Texas. hell, even Karl Rove and Lindsay Grahm are saying this isn't constitutional. That should tell you something.

I'm not biased against Mexicans. I love Mexican food.

Just like you dont mind French , cause of Fries and you dont mind polish people cause of the sausage and you specially dont mind Norweigian people cause you feel sorry for stupid people

[Rockindeano]

I don't understand why so many people have so much sympathy for these lawbreakers here. There are solutions but it's gonna take some tough, draconian moves to make a difference. Most people don't have the spine for it. America has become pussified!

No one here is granting an ounce of sympathy to any 'lawbreaker.' Our point is that many people, brown folk, who are in fact American or here awaiting citizenship, are not criminals. You just made our point about this bullshit law. It's a racist law, and one without thought or understanding. No one here has stood in opposition to immigration reform....just the way it's being dealt with by the state of Arizona and soon to be Texas. hell, even Karl Rove and Lindsay Grahm are saying this isn't constitutional. That should tell you something.

I'm not biased against Mexicans. I love Mexican food.

Just like you dont mind French , cause of Fries and you dont mind polish people cause of the sausage and you specially dont mind Norweigian people cause you feel sorry for stupid people

Hey you Sand Pirate didn't you grow up in Sweden? IIRC, you said you did...anyway, my new orthopedist is a Swede and he is one smart motherfucker. Used to be Medical doctor for the Denver Broncos and US Ski Team. He is great too, because when he drains my fuckin knees, he numbs me up so much with Novocaine(which isn't necessary), that I get higher than Christian Slater at an open bar. It's awesome. My old Doc would just spray some alcohol on the skin and pierce the knee, and out comes the fluid. I dropped his sorry ass because he is aganst prescribing the greatest drug known to man, Vicodin.