Time For Gowan To Move On

[Boomchild]

I don't think you guys understand what I mean by Gowan ruining Styx My point is he has ruined this incarnation of STYX by trying to replicate a legend in the former band, It just never worked and to this day it does not work , If he would just sit back and not sing anything I think more people would like this version,
If the band just played songs theye were responsible for vocally and not Dennis material the same would apply = More fans

Look we have fun here going back and forth but the bottom line is nobody will touch this version of STYX for the reason that Larry Gowan is ripping off Dennis and it's worn thin. Even Chicago Styx has come out and said look for Dennis back in late 2011 now that say's it all.

Actually, he's not trying to replicate Dennis - at least in voice. One of the things I appreciate about Gowan is he's being Gowan. They didn't hire a soundalike, which to some degree was a bold move. Clearly some of the material was not suited for his voice and it's gone.

Compare this to Journey or other "legacy/classic" bands like Foreigner who have gone one without one of their signature members - they generally hire soundalikes. Some have been OK, others not very good. With Gowan they had a chance to form their own identity post-Dennis, and while far from a perfect record, Gowan isn't trying to be Dennis on Cyclorama.

So Gowan has nothing to do with fucking up Styx. He's not the root of all evils.

Actually, I think that Styx not hiring a "soundalike" was the correct for thing for them to do.

[Boomchild]

From what Im hearing the fall tour is not selling well at all.

Yeah we all know where YOU get your info from. These tickets are flying faster then dennis's chance of having a hit song in the U.S.

The chances of the current Styx or DDY having a hit record in the US are the same. Slim to none.

[Boomchild]

I'd love to see Dennis back with Lawrence doing keyboards/third guitar. (Dennis has said that he doesn't want to play full time keyboard anymore)

Actually, I think DDY stated that with him being the central focus in his shows he can't be stuck behind a keyboard for the show. I don't think that he has lost interest in playing them.

[Boomchild]

dennis thinks larry is great why can't you?

Really, what is your source for this information? I have never heard or seen DDY make any comment regarding Gowan.

[yogi]

Dennis DID make a comment about Gowan being GREAT way way back when Gowan first joined the band.

The comment was something like if Aerosmith went out and hired Rod Stewert to replace Steven Tyler.

The way I read it was that Dennis was giving Gowan major props for being an excellent singer & musician, but he was also saying he was a wrong fit for Styx.

[SuiteMadameBlue]

Dennis DID make a comment about Gowan being GREAT way way back when Gowan first joined the band.

The comment was something like if Aerosmith went out and hired Rod Stewert to replace Steven Tyler.

The way I read it was that Dennis was giving Gowan major props for being an excellent singer & musician, but he was also saying he was a wrong fit for Styx.

This is part of the interview between DDY and StyxCollector in which he mentions the Rod Stewart replacing Steven Tyler comment..........

AH: Despite all the problems right now, it seems Todd [Sucherman] is filling in John Panozzo's shoes fairly well.
DDY: Todd Sucherman? Todd's a wonderful drummer.
AH: He's very powerful and right in the Styx mold.
DDY: He's a wonderful drummer. Have you seen the show yet - the new band?
AH: I have, I have. It's ... not the same. It's a different show. That's all I can really say. I wasn't thrilled when they did some of your songs, I will admit, and I'm sure you'll hear that as well.
DDY: I've heard it over and over again.
AH: His piano playing is good.
DDY: No he's a great ... look. Let me ask you a question.
AH: Okay
DDY: Is Rod Stewart a really good singer?
AH: Absolutely
DDY: If you took Steven Tyler out of Aerosmith and stuck Rod Stewart in there, can he sing?
AH: Yeah, it wouldn't be the same.
DDY: Would it be Aerosmith?
AH: It just wouldn't be the same.
DDY: Alright. And the fact of the matter is, I am the soul of that ... you do know why this new album doesn't sound like it's a Styx album, don't you?
AH: Well, pretty much you've been behind the controls for the most part.
DDY: I produced them! Every Styx album since Equinox. That's why. Does Edge Of The Century sound like Styx? Yes. Doesn't it?
AH: Mmm hmmm - absolutely
DDY: Did all the new songs on the live album - "Dear John", right? Did you ever say, "Hey, this doesn't sound like Styx" one time?
AH: Not at all
DDY: When did it not sound like Styx to you? On this record. And you want to know why? Because I was the guy who could bring those three different songwriters together, and, I believe, make the correct decisions on what songs should get on the album and how we should go about doing them.

[yogi]

Thanks Suite( & Alan). I knew that I had read that somewhere.

Dennis is EXACTLY correct. He(Gowan)is GREAT... but he is not a DDY clone. He is NOT the correct fit for those who wanted one or who drank from Dennis's bathwater.

Unlike Journey, Tommy & JY didnt want a Dennis sound alike. So be it.

For me he brings a Rush sound to Dennis's songs.

[SuiteMadameBlue]

For me he brings a Rush sound to Dennis's songs.

OUCH!! I have to disagree, no offense. Rush is one of my favorite bands and I can't hear that at all.

You're welcome on the article

[Ash]

Rush? To Dennis Songs? Are you smoking crack? (said with love)

I just find myself torn over this to some degree. I have to admit, that the nuJourney with the Steve Perry sound-alike is very appealing to me. I really like it --- even some of the remakes they did have a vibe to them that I can appreciate.

But Gowan doing DeYoung's music is a slap in the face to me. Maybe I'm more emotionally invested in DDY's music with Styx than I am with Steve Perry's... Maybe it's the fact that instead of approaching DeYoung's music with a sense of respect and reverence they give some of their other songs, they approach it as a "well, we gotta play this one... so here goes" mentality. Maybe it's the attitude. But even that I think I could move past if I actually liked the guy's voice.

I just don't.

It's not that he can't sing or that he can't play. He just isn't right for this part. Others will disagree, and that's fine.

it's like when I listen to some Mariah Carey wannabe sing the national anthem at the Superbowl... They scat all over the place and add all these other notes and shit to the song that weren't part of the melody. I feel like saying "come ON! Pick a note and sing it!" I feel that way when I hear some person who didn't write or participate in the creation of the song taking liberties that they shouldn't be taking because they haven't earned it.

If RUSH were to play Grand Illusion or Pieces of Eight or some other really grand style song and "make it their own" it would be MORE acceptable to me because those guys are fricking legends and have at least earned the right to interpret. Gowan has not. Even though he's part of the band now.

I dunno... hard for me to explain. Doesn't really jive with my appreciation for nuJourney because that guy hasn't done shit to warrant him interpreting Perry's work either. But in his case, I think he's trying to stick as best as he can to the original melody and structure of the song without deviation. Which still makes it almost a cover version... but at least it's better quality and the guy can really sing Perry's part.

[yogi]

I am seeing Rush the 26TH in Dallas.

For me Gowan can sing. He was VERY good on Walrus, I like him on The Grand Illusion & Come Sail Away. Gowan sounds VERY Geddy Lee to me. It gives these songs a Rush flair.

Since its the way it is, I like it much better than a DDY rip off clone sound a like.

[Keiferb]

JY saved Styx.
Dennis was busy doing Broadway.

What? And how did you arrive at that conclusion? That might be one of the dumbest statements I've read to date. Remarkable.

[bugsymalone]

I have always felt Gowan was brought in as a keyboard player (who could handle DDY's keyboard work) who, they felt, could sing, rather than a singer who happened to play keys pretty well.

So, Froy, while I am NO FAN of Gowan's in any way, shape or form, I do not think he is "the ruination of Styx." The decline of the band kinda happened when Dennis was booted, IMO, because his contributions to the band were so enormous. But the times were changing no matter what and what exists today is pretty much it, I am certain. Gowan is not going to up and leave the money tree.

They are going to cling to the past with what helps them make a great living. They are also, apparently, and unlike Dennis, going to cling to their recording past as well.

As I have said 40 billion times on here (it seems), I will ignore what the current lineup does, musically, and pay attention to (and support) everything Dennis does, because he is the reason I became a Styx fan in the first place.


Bugsy

[Keiferb]

Rush? To Dennis Songs? Are you smoking crack? (said with love)

I just find myself torn over this to some degree. I have to admit, that the nuJourney with the Steve Perry sound-alike is very appealing to me. I really like it --- even some of the remakes they did have a vibe to them that I can appreciate.

But Gowan doing DeYoung's music is a slap in the face to me. Maybe I'm more emotionally invested in DDY's music with Styx than I am with Steve Perry's... Maybe it's the fact that instead of approaching DeYoung's music with a sense of respect and reverence they give some of their other songs, they approach it as a "well, we gotta play this one... so here goes" mentality. Maybe it's the attitude. But even that I think I could move past if I actually liked the guy's voice.

I just don't.

It's not that he can't sing or that he can't play. He just isn't right for this part. Others will disagree, and that's fine.

it's like when I listen to some Mariah Carey wannabe sing the national anthem at the Superbowl... They scat all over the place and add all these other notes and shit to the song that weren't part of the melody. I feel like saying "come ON! Pick a note and sing it!" I feel that way when I hear some person who didn't write or participate in the creation of the song taking liberties that they shouldn't be taking because they haven't earned it.

If RUSH were to play Grand Illusion or Pieces of Eight or some other really grand style song and "make it their own" it would be MORE acceptable to me because those guys are fricking legends and have at least earned the right to interpret. Gowan has not. Even though he's part of the band now.

I dunno... hard for me to explain. Doesn't really jive with my appreciation for nuJourney because that guy hasn't done shit to warrant him interpreting Perry's work either. But in his case, I think he's trying to stick as best as he can to the original melody and structure of the song without deviation. Which still makes it almost a cover version... but at least it's better quality and the guy can really sing Perry's part.

I completely agree, and can relate to your opinions here. Arnel is an attempted sound alike, but at least he does it well, and he sounds GOOD. I'll give you another example. I'm a big Supertramp fan, and I'm sure you know the story. When Rick Davies originally found the replacement for Roger Hodgson (Mark Hart, I think from Crowded House?), everyone pitched a fit. I saw the Some Things Never Change Tour in '97 (There's a Live album from this tour - "It Was the Best of Times" - which is one of my favorite discs. Ironic title. Would I have preferred Hodgson? Of course. I have "almost" every Supertramp AND Hodgson solo effort. From a pure Supertramp perspective, I think STNC is one of their best albums.

Anyway, on the original STNC disc, in concert, and on the live disc, Mark Hart did not sound (nor attempt to) like Roger Hogson. But, he sounded GOOD. He did not do the original versions a disservice at all. He had also contributed new music to the band, and they were good songs.

Supertramp is now touring again, and Mark Hart is not with them. I think Jesse Siebenberg (son of drummer Bob Siebenberg) is now singing Roger's songs, and from some samples now available out on the Web, I'm not sure I like his versions - it's like he's trying to sound like Hodgson. Will say, even though he sounds a little pitchy, it still doesn't bother me like Gowan (IMO). You can here a couple of samples here:

http://simfylive.com/en/shop/29390/live ... _lid=47318

So, maybe Froy will be right. Maybe Styx will under-sell the PO8/GI gig, and Supertramp will do the same on their current tour, and both will be open to reconciliation and reunion. Now how's that for smoking crack?

[Monker]

Thanks Suite( & Alan). I knew that I had read that somewhere.

Dennis is EXACTLY correct. He(Gowan)is GREAT... but he is not a DDY clone. He is NOT the correct fit for those who wanted one or who drank from Dennis's bathwater.

Unlike Journey, Tommy & JY didnt want a Dennis sound alike. So be it.

For me he brings a Rush sound to Dennis's songs.

That is not what Journey wanted either....until after JSS.

[gr8dane]

JY saved Styx.
Dennis was busy doing Broadway.

What? And how did you arrive at that conclusion? That might be one of the dumbest statements I've read to date. Remarkable.

Well,I am not as smart as you.

[Babyblue]

Thanks Suite( & Alan). I knew that I had read that somewhere.

Dennis is EXACTLY correct. He(Gowan)is GREAT... but he is not a DDY clone. He is NOT the correct fit for those who wanted one or who drank from Dennis's bathwater.

Unlike Journey, Tommy & JY didnt want a Dennis sound alike. So be it.

For me he brings a Rush sound to Dennis's songs.

That is not what Journey wanted either....until after JSS.

I would have liked for JSS to still be with them.He was great

[StyxCollector]

This is part of the interview between DDY and StyxCollector in which he mentions the Rod Stewart replacing Steven Tyler comment..........

Funny. I didn't remember that and it's my interview!

[Keiferb]

JY saved Styx.
Dennis was busy doing Broadway.

What? And how did you arrive at that conclusion? That might be one of the dumbest statements I've read to date. Remarkable.

Well,I am not as smart as you.

Oh, all right, a little opinionated and righteous. Point taken. But, do you really believe that? You think Styx is "saved"?

[Monker]

Thanks Suite( & Alan). I knew that I had read that somewhere.

Dennis is EXACTLY correct. He(Gowan)is GREAT... but he is not a DDY clone. He is NOT the correct fit for those who wanted one or who drank from Dennis's bathwater.

Unlike Journey, Tommy & JY didnt want a Dennis sound alike. So be it.

For me he brings a Rush sound to Dennis's songs.

That is not what Journey wanted either....until after JSS.

I would have liked for JSS to still be with them.He was great

They had a happy medium with Augeri...someone who was enough like Perry to cover the old songs, but also a bit different. Then JSS was way TOO different. And, now Arnel who is way too much of a clone for me. Journey deserves the critique as much as Dennis deserves it for hiring a Tommy clone.

[Boomchild]

Dennis DID make a comment about Gowan being GREAT way way back when Gowan first joined the band.

The comment was something like if Aerosmith went out and hired Rod Stewert to replace Steven Tyler.

The way I read it was that Dennis was giving Gowan major props for being an excellent singer & musician, but he was also saying he was a wrong fit for Styx.

Interesting, I never saw that. I thought he would not address such a question.

[gr8dane]

JY saved Styx.
Dennis was busy doing Broadway.

What? And how did you arrive at that conclusion? That might be one of the dumbest statements I've read to date. Remarkable.

Well,I am not as smart as you.

Oh, all right, a little opinionated and righteous. Point taken. But, do you really believe that? You think Styx is "saved"?

Who the hell knows.
If Dennis was more successful on Broadway,we would probably get a new Styx album every 4-5 years and a tour in the US and a few dates in Canada once every 4-5 years.
On those tours we would probably get to hear 2 or 3 new songs .Or we would get another Kilroy like tour.
Maybe that is better.Dennis seems to be happy to work from home.JY and Tommy is out playing live.
Styx has been losing fans since Paradise theatre,so everything is speculation.
Even with Dennis in Styx ,nobody knows ,there matey.
So the ones who like to hear some old Styx, can catch them as one many nostalgia acts out there.
What is better?Depends.

[Babyblue]

Thanks Suite( & Alan). I knew that I had read that somewhere.

Dennis is EXACTLY correct. He(Gowan)is GREAT... but he is not a DDY clone. He is NOT the correct fit for those who wanted one or who drank from Dennis's bathwater.

Unlike Journey, Tommy & JY didnt want a Dennis sound alike. So be it.

For me he brings a Rush sound to Dennis's songs.

That is not what Journey wanted either....until after JSS.

I would have liked for JSS to still be with them.He was great

They had a happy medium with Augeri...someone who was enough like Perry to cover the old songs, but also a bit different. Then JSS was way TOO different. And, now Arnel who is way too much of a clone for me. Journey deserves the critique as much as Dennis deserves it for hiring a Tommy clone.

You are very right Monker, but after SP left & they were with soundalikes.I just gave up on them SP was a big part of that band for me.I enjoyed JSS because he was so different.When i first heard lights on the radio it was the voice i heard.

[froy]

Monker"

Journey deserves the critique as much as Dennis deserves it for hiring a Tommy clone.

Sorry but Dennis is not a band, It's a guy playing the parts of songs he had a part in producing.
He deserves no critique at all. Plus he waited 10 years to bring out what 3 songs big deal

[froy]

gr8dane

Who the hell knows.
If Dennis was more successful on Broadway,we would probably get a new Styx album every 4-5 years

And now without him you never get a cd of new music. Cover cds are all that is left

[Monker]

Monker"

Journey deserves the critique as much as Dennis deserves it for hiring a Tommy clone.

Sorry but Dennis is not a band,

You're right. He's just a solo guy pretending he is still in his former band, even hiring clones to surround himself with and reproduce the songs in a tribute band sorta way.

He deserves no critique at all.

Anybody who hires a singer because he can clone the original vocal deserves such critique.

[froy]

Monker"

Journey deserves the critique as much as Dennis deserves it for hiring a Tommy clone.

Sorry but Dennis is not a band,

You're right. He's just a solo guy
that's enough

He deserves no critique at all.

Anybody who hires a singer because he can clone the original vocal deserves such critique.

Anyone could sing like Shaw big deal, I could go on stage with Dennis and sing all the Shaw songs so could Brywool
Shaw has a nothing voice

[brywool]

Anyone could sing like Shaw big deal, I could go on stage with Dennis and sing all the Shaw songs so could Brywool
Shaw has a nothing voice

um, how should I take this??

[Keiferb]

Anyone could sing like Shaw big deal, I could go on stage with Dennis and sing all the Shaw songs so could Brywool
Shaw has a nothing voice

Froy, come on now. I agree w/you on most issues around DDY, but I also think TS is just as integral to the music "THEY" created together. Is his voice aging over time? Well, he is getting older. But so is DDY, and while he still sounds great, the cracks of age are showing up there too. Let's be realistic.

I appreciate just as much of TS's music as I do DDY. The fact that he allows himself to be gelded by JY is another matter. And while JY is a distant 3rd in the pecking order of importance in my mind, his contributions help make them what they are (or were). That's why I'm a purist on this matter - whether right or wrong - because it took all 3 of them. And I'm not intending to diminish the Panozzos, or Todd.

This morning, I was listening to KWH on the way to breakfast (go ahead, make fun, but I actually like most of that disc), and I find the 2nd half the best part of the album - it's all TS & JY, with their harmonies. As I rotate between Equinox and Cyclorama, I find it interesting to hear the differences vocally as they've aged. I'll tell you, unless I'm deaf (I cannot sing a lick I'll admit, so I could not go on stage), I think TS as gotten better with age. Is he DDY good? No. He is what he is, and it ain't bad. I'd be just as disillusioned if someone else were mangling his songs as I am DDY's.

Dude, even though I tend to agree with you on many points, you're SO blindly loyal to DDY that I think you might be jaded on other fronts. Your sound nearly insane over it, sorta like BabyBlue w/Gowan. Wow, the two of you are more alike than you know!

[Monker]

You're right. He's just a solo guy
that's enough

It SHOULD be enough...but, it's not. He has to be a solo guy pretending to be in his old band, surrounding himself by soundalikes to sing songs to fill out his set list so the audience can pretend they are listening to a band from 30yrs ago.

He deserves no critique at all.

Anybody who hires a singer because he can clone the original vocal deserves such critique.

Anyone could sing like Shaw big deal, I could go on stage with Dennis and sing all the Shaw songs so could Brywool
Shaw has a nothing voice

To me, that means that DDY shouldn't even touch Tommy's Styx songs - at all.

[froy]

Anyone could sing like Shaw big deal, I could go on stage with Dennis and sing all the Shaw songs so could Brywool
Shaw has a nothing voice

To me, that means that DDY shouldn't even touch Tommy's Styx songs - at all.

They are not Tommy's Styx songs they are STYX songs sung by Tommy,
At least August nails them unlike the counterpart