Star Wars

[S2M]

BTW, ST destroys SW.....just saying.

[Starrider]

Don't you know Dirk Benedict is cooler than Richard Hatch? (Seriously, though, I've met Dirk and he is a WAY cool guy, and we had a very interesting conversation that had nothing to do with BSG.)

Yeah, I could've sworn Starbuck "died" in Galactica 1980, so that trailer makes even less sense since it's supposed to "pick up" where the '70s show left off.

He is cool, and I loved his cameo in the A-Team movie! Yes, the plot I remember had to do with Starbuck crash-landing on some planet with a Cylon centurion in sort of an "Enemy Mine" style story. I should dig it out and watch it.

BSG: The Second Coming was supposed to pick up where the original series left off, ignoring the events of Galactica 1980, which sucked ass.

The episode where Starbuck crash-landed was known as "The Return of Starbuck." It was the last episode of Galactica 1980 to air. In that episode, it was left open-ended as to whether Starbuck lived or died. Apparently, they were going to say he was picked up by the "Ship of Lights" from the original series. Supposedly, that was in the draft of a script for an episode that never got filmed because the series got cancelled.

[The_Noble_Cause]

If you scroll up, you'll see not one, but two of us already included this information in our posts. I even included a link.

Totally mssed that. My bad.

[The_Noble_Cause]

LOL How you can say that in good conscience and not attribute the exact same sentence to Star Bores is beyond me.

I recall Manakin built robots when he was a wee lad, but his son Fluke bickered a lot and these old guys Yogurt and OB1 loved to dole out the spiritual mumbu-jumbo. ("Ride the white horse, Fluke.") Episode III and Episode IV involved a lot of emo navel-gazing. At worst, every movie beyond the original 1977 "episode" is a tacked-on tumor-esque flourish laden with cheese and mold, anachronisms and inconsistencies — and let's not forget the wooden dialogue and uninspired acting. Planet-hopping does not alone a SF story make. George desperately wanted to make his Buck Rogers for a new age, and along the way decided it was okay to combine it with Hidden Fortress and aspects of Star Trek.

See? It's easy to do that.

I've never mentioned Star Wars. Star Wars was fun. I am really not passionate about it. I'd label it as fantasy, if anything. It's def. not sci-fi.

'90s "WB-type pseudo-SF cheese. I didn't even realize at first you were talking about the show with Jerry O'Connell.

Wormholes and parallel dimensions are the stuff of Stephn Hawking and theoretical physics, not a bunch of teenyboppers getting their dicks wet. What a ludicrous comparison. The execution, at it worst, was Time Tunnel-type Sid and Marty Krofft shlock, but it was ambitious and when it worked, it worked. The showrunner, Tracey Torme, wrote for ST. Again, the WB comparison is idiotic.

The US doesn't need an "answer to Dr. Who. I don't watch it, but last I checked, Dr. Who is still going.

Umm, Dr. Who stopped production in 1989. The revival happened only very very recently. The Matt Smith seasons have been great thanks to Steven Moffat - a brilliant writer who has taken over reigns. The initial re-launch, handled by Russel T. Davies, was total shit. Like EastEnders w/ time travel as merely an afterthought. Almost as soap opera-y and gay as the new BSG.

[verslibre]

LOL How you can say that in good conscience and not attribute the exact same sentence to Star Bores is beyond me.

I recall Manakin built robots when he was a wee lad, but his son Fluke bickered a lot and these old guys Yogurt and OB1 loved to dole out the spiritual mumbu-jumbo. ("Ride the white horse, Fluke.") Episode III and Episode IV involved a lot of emo navel-gazing. At worst, every movie beyond the original 1977 "episode" is a tacked-on tumor-esque flourish laden with cheese and mold, anachronisms and inconsistencies — and let's not forget the wooden dialogue and uninspired acting. Planet-hopping does not alone a SF story make. George desperately wanted to make his Buck Rogers for a new age, and along the way decided it was okay to combine it with Hidden Fortress and aspects of Star Trek.

See? It's easy to do that.

I've never mentioned Star Wars.

Indirectly, you did:

SyFy's Battlestar Galactica reboot kicked the crap out of Star Bores!

No, it didn't.

'90s "WB-type pseudo-SF cheese. I didn't even realize at first you were talking about the show with Jerry O'Connell.

Wormholes and parallel dimensions are the stuff of Stephn Hawking and theoretical physics, not a bunch of teenyboppers getting their dicks wet. What a ludicrous comparison. The execution, at it worst, was Time Tunnel-type Sid and Marty Krofft shlock, but it was ambitious and when it worked, it worked. The showrunner, Tracey Torme, wrote for ST. Again, the WB comparison is idiotic.

The couple episodes I saw reeked of a dramedy in a SF dressing. Turned me off (and I wasn't that interested, to begin with).

The US doesn't need an "answer to Dr. Who. I don't watch it, but last I checked, Dr. Who is still going.

Umm, Dr. Who stopped production in 1989. The revival happened only very very recently.

The revival with Christopher Eccleston was in '05, episodes filmed in '04. That's like seven years' worth of new Doctor Who episodes, right? There was also a mid-'90s standalone movie, an American production, that was universally panned.

The Matt Smith seasons have been great thanks to Steven Moffat - a brilliant writer who has taken over reigns. The initial re-launch, handled by Russel T. Davies, was total shit. Like EastEnders w/ time travel as merely an afterthought. Almost as soap opera-y and gay as the new BSG.

I only saw the episodes (referring to IMDb for the titles, LOL), "Rose," "The End Of The World," "Dalek," and the season ender where Eccleston morphed into Tennant. For what they were, I thought they were solid. The "Dalek" episode was pretty cool. I caught a couple from the Tennant season and nothing since. I don't think I could watch this Matt Smith guy, anyway, because that dude is the downright WEIRDEST looking mofo ever. He doesn't look male or female, he looks like a different sex entirely. HAHA!!

[S2M]

Tom Baker is my favorite, and the one I grew up watching.....I don't think I ever 'got' the show....but it was interesting to just watch and vege.

[The_Noble_Cause]

Indirectly, you did:

Fair enough. But I'm not hardcore about it. In terms of popcorn entertainment, I'll take the original trilogy over the empty high-minded pretensions of Nu BSG anytime.

The couple episodes I saw reeked of a dramedy in a SF dressing. Turned me off (and I wasn't that interested, to begin with).

And yet, BSG somehow kept you breathlessly glued to your barcalounger? Most mainstream US attempst at scifi are really dramedy. Sliders at least didn't fuck over its viewers, and try to be about *something* when it truly had all the theological/sociological/political weight of a 'Welcome Back Kotter' repeat. In short, BSG was a con job.

The revival with Christopher Eccleston was in '05, episodes filmed in '04. That's like seven years' worth of new Doctor Who episodes, right? There was also a mid-'90s standalone movie, an American production, that was universally panned.

I said Sliders was the domestic answer to Dr. Who. During Sliders run (95-2000), Dr. Who hadn't been on in ages. Additionally, the older episodes were carried sporadically on public broadcasting stations because BBC America didn't even exist yet. My statement stands.

I don't think I could watch this Matt Smith guy, anyway, because that dude is the downright WEIRDEST looking mofo ever. He doesn't look male or female, he looks like a different sex entirely. HAHA!!

The most popular Whos (Baker and Pertwee) are not exactly normal looking. That's like critiquing Sherlock Holmes for being too detail-oriented or James Bond for being too debonair. Maybe Nu BSG appealed to you so much because your knowledge of good scifi is limited. Not being a prick. Just saying...

[The_Noble_Cause]

Tom Baker is my favorite, and the one I grew up watching.....I don't think I ever 'got' the show....but it was interesting to just watch and vege.

I wish BBC or SyFy would get the rights to air the older episodes. Bad efx notwithstanding, they still hold up.

[verslibre]

Indirectly, you did:

Fair enough. But I'm not hardcore about it.

You're just a hater of Moore's BSG. Got it.

In short, BSG was a con job.

I forget: are you one of those "GINO" guys?

The revival with Christopher Eccleston was in '05, episodes filmed in '04. That's like seven years' worth of new Doctor Who episodes, right? There was also a mid-'90s standalone movie, an American production, that was universally panned.

I said Sliders was the domestic answer to Dr. Who. During Sliders run (95-2000), Dr. Who hadn't been on in ages. Additionally, the older episodes were carried sporadically on public broadcasting stations because BBC America didn't even exist yet. My statement stands.

It's relative. I didn't look at it that way because it had only been off the air five years when Sliders started. 1963 to 1989. Twenty-six years. That's what I call a LONG-running show.

I don't think I could watch this Matt Smith guy, anyway, because that dude is the downright WEIRDEST looking mofo ever. He doesn't look male or female, he looks like a different sex entirely. HAHA!!

The most popular Whos (Baker and Pertwee) are not exactly normal looking. That's like critiquing Sherlock Holmes for being too detail-oriented or James Bond for being too debonair.

No, no, no. You're going way off on a tangent. I'm talking specifically — only — about the "current" guy. He's fuckin' weird-looking. Maybe you just don't see it.

Maybe Nu BSG appealed to you so much because your knowledge of good scifi is limited. Not being a prick. Just saying...

No, actually, you're being a fucking dick. And if your idea of bitchin' sci-fi is Sliders, knock yourself out.

[pinkfloyd1973]

Sliders, Stargate SG-1 and even Stargate Atlantis were pretty kewl shows on Sci-Fi/SyFy

[Monker]

IMO, Sliders was way past due to be canceled.

I dunno. Even without Jerry O'Connell, the last season had some decent eps. It's all about the writing.

Yes, but they wrote themselves into a corner. They strayed too far from the original "What would happen if Hitler won the war?" theme and into Kromags. None of the gang sliding had any place they were trying to return to. Rembrandt was the only one of them that any connection to "Earth Prime".. And, the way they ended Wade Wells was just disturbing at best. The first two seasons were outstanding. The third was pretty good. The run on SciFi was average and could have been so much more.

[verslibre]

I'm curious: why did you both neglect to mention Fox had dropped Sliders? Sounds more like Sci Fi Channel rescued it, if anything. From what I read on IMDb, its cancellation had more to do with the show taking a sharp nosedive, not freeing up money for BSG.

"Kromaggs"...LOL

[Monker]

I'm curious: why did you both neglect to mention Fox had dropped Sliders? Sounds more like Sci Fi Channel rescued it, if anything. From what I read on IMDb, its cancellation had more to do with the show taking a sharp nosedive, not freeing up money for BSG.

"Kromaggs"...LOL

I didn't mention it because NobelCause knows what he's talking about and I knew he wouldn't have to look the history up.

I'm not the one making the budget argument...at least not with Sliders.

Now, Farscape, I would say it's cancellation was never explained very well...and funding BSG could be a good possibility...because the budget of Farscape had to be HUGE...for the FX and for the number of actors they used.

[The_Noble_Cause]

It's relative. I didn't look at it that way because it had only been off the air five years when Sliders started. 1963 to 1989. Twenty-six years. That's what I call a LONG-running show.

In those 26 years, Dr. Who never once had a stable US home. If you were lucky, it was carried on your local PBS affiliate at midnite. Or you found VHS copies at your local library. It had been off for a mere FIVE years in Europe. In the states, it never really got exposure.

No, actually, you're being a fucking dick. And if your idea of bitchin' sci-fi is Sliders, knock yourself out.

A show which you admittedly didn't watch, and weren't even aware was from one of the creative braintrusts behind "ST: Next Generation." Sliders, like X-Files, is one of the best US genre shows in the last 50 years. I watched all of Nu BSG, liked alot of it, but ultimately it couldn't deliver on the BIG questions it cock-teased viewers with. As with LOST, it left audiences with a raging case of blue balls. If you like being yanked around, good for you. More discerning viewers caught wise to the fact that Ron Moore's bag of promises was empty and bailed.

[The_Noble_Cause]

I'm not the one making the budget argument...at least not with Sliders.

Specifically, Farscape was cancelled to make room for BSG. Sliders was just one of many misguided decisions by SyFy brass. The Invisible Man had great ratings and they drove it into the ground. Same deal with GvsE, a hit show on USA, which SyFy managed to turn into pure ratings poison.

The run on SciFi was average and could have been so much more.

Agreed. SyFy had a choice to bring back Tracy Torme (ST: TNG) to run his show or keep the hack, David Peckinpah, which FOX had appointed. Peckinpah was responsible for boneheaded decisions like killing off John Rhys-Davies and doing movie-of-the week episodes, ripping off everything from Twister to Jurrasic Park. SyFy kept David on, but a few good ST writers and freelancers, like Marc Scott Zicree, managed to squeak out a few classics.

It's alot like Journey. The potential was there, just never fully realized, partially thanks to clashing egos and missed opportunities.

[S2M]

This past spring and summer I ended up watching Voyager, never having seen it during it's initial run. I pretty much liked the borg plotline, and who doesn't love watching Ryan walk around in those outfits...I'd have to say the Doctor was my favorite character, then 7 of 9. It got a little hokie seeing Janeway not take advantage of ways to get home faster(that being her biggest goal). I was VERY diappointed in the last episode. It seemed to end rather abruptly, and without much fanfare. You never got see any of the characters' lives once home....

[verslibre]

In those 26 years, Dr. Who never once had a stable US home.

Are you really surprised? It wasn't a US production. It's not like nowadays, when stuff on both sides of the pond gets tossed back and forth like a jai alai ball.

In the states, it never really got exposure.

If you felt that strongly for it, you could've always moved to Britain and enjoyed it twice a day, seven days a week.

No, actually, you're being a fucking dick. And if your idea of bitchin' sci-fi is Sliders, knock yourself out.

A show which you admittedly didn't watch, and weren't even aware was from one of the creative braintrusts behind "ST: Next Generation."

The latter bit of info didn't, and doesn't, matter to me. You speak of this guy in a hushed tone as though he were Harlan Ellison or Joe Haldeman. One of T.T.'s credits (as a producer, which could include script tinkering-with) is that crap remake of I Am Legend with Will Smith. Should we all be so impressed?

I think what's more noteworthy is that you watched BSG all the way to the end.

You know, when I don't like a show...I don't watch it. Nor do I force myself to watch something that pretends to be more intelligent than its viewership. I didn't watch Lost past the first season. Didn't care. I didn't watch Firefly. Didn't care. (I TRIED to watch Serenity. I fell asleep during the movie.) I tried to watch Enterprise. I saw an interesting episode here or there, but if I didn't get hooked before the quarter-hour commercial break, I invested my time doing something else. And I consider myself a patient guy, too. I still have not seen all episodes of ST:TNG or Voyager. Reruns of the former are pretty easy to come by on WGN or SyFy, though. Not as interested in the latter. I'd rather see DS9 reruns but that one's getting the little-boy-in-the-corner treatment for whatever reason.

Sliders, like X-Files, is one of the best US genre shows in the last 50 years.

Now you're putting it on par with X-Files? Stop yanking me crank, bucko.

I watched all of Nu BSG, liked alot of it, but ultimately it couldn't deliver on the BIG questions it cock-teased viewers with. As with LOST, it left audiences with a raging case of blue balls. If you like being yanked around, good for you. More discerning viewers caught wise to the fact that Ron Moore's bag of promises was empty and bailed.

"More discerning viewers" for the most part were the GINOs — Galactic In Name Only haters who still want the '70s show replicated. At first, I wasn't too keen on the reboot, but I knew I'd definitely give it a fair shake. The miniseries clinched it. Likewise, the first two back-to-back episodes of the series proper ("33" and "Water") were excellent, and for a long time, that level of quality was maintained and then exceeded. It wasn't till the last season when things got sketchy, and then Moore left us doing some headscratching in the final hour. And gee-fucking-whiz was it better than than those gayass Stargate shows. More Sci Fi/SyFy fodder I couldn't bear to sit through. TransMorphers, anyone?

[The_Noble_Cause]

Are you really surprised? It wasn't a US production. It's not like nowadays, when stuff on both sides of the pond gets tossed back and forth like a jai alai ball.

Not the point. I said that Sliders was the US answer to Dr. Who. You disputed that, saying that Dr. Who was already on the air and going strong. As already pointed out, that was barely true.

One of T.T.'s credits (as a producer, which could include script tinkering-with) is that crap remake of I Am Legend with Will Smith. Should we all be so impressed?

Your uninformed posts reek of fly-by Wikipedia and IMDB searching. Just a few posts up, you didn't even know what Sliders was. Now you're trying to discredit it. Much like the writing staff at BSG, you’re clearly just making things up as you go along. "I am Legend" floundered in Hollywood development hell for years and underwent multiple re-writes. That's like holding Ron Moore accountable for the lackluster Thing prequel/remake, which at one point he was attached.

I think what's more noteworthy is that you watched BSG all the way to the end.

Unlike you, I try to actually know what I'm talking about before I hail shit. Yes, I did watch all of it. How else would I be able to critique it? I already said I liked parts of it. But to compare it to something as game-changing as Star Wars is laughable. As Monker noted, nu BSG has not left a dent on the pop cultural landscape. It was a critical darling, in the same way that the music press loves Elvis Costello and other artists nobody cares to listen to.

Now you're putting it on par with X-Files? Stop yanking me crank, bucko.

Why not? The X-Files was essentially Kolchak :The Night Stalker with a co-female lead. Like Sliders, Kolchak featured a great premise and was also underappreciated and short-lived. You prolly never watched either show, so just who are you to weigh in again anyway?

"More discerning viewers" for the most part were the GINOs — Galactic In Name Only haters who still want the '70s show replicated. At first, I wasn't too keen on the reboot, but I knew I'd definitely give it a fair shake. The miniseries clinched it. Likewise, the first two back-to-back episodes of the series proper ("33" and "Water") were excellent, and for a long time, that level of quality was maintained and then exceeded. It wasn't till the last season when things got sketchy, and then Moore left us doing some headscratching in the final hour. And gee-fucking-whiz was it better than than those gayass Stargate shows. More Sci Fi/SyFy fodder I couldn't bear to sit through. TransMorphers, anyone?

I’m not a GINO. I am just a guy that has watched way too much TV. BSG promised big things, but when it came time to deliver on its own grand designs, it failed. It desperately wanted to be Babylon 5, but they didn’t actually plan for the show to last. So what viewers ended up with was more like LOST in space.

[verslibre]

Are you really surprised? It wasn't a US production. It's not like nowadays, when stuff on both sides of the pond gets tossed back and forth like a jai alai ball.

Not the point. I said that Sliders was the US answer to Dr. Who. You disputed that, saying that Dr. Who was already on the air and going strong. As already pointed out, that was barely true.

No, I said that last I checked, it was "still going," which it is, for seven years now. I said that because I was unaware of exactly how long it had been off the air. I only knew that the initial run was a LONG one.

One of T.T.'s credits (as a producer, which could include script tinkering-with) is that crap remake of I Am Legend with Will Smith. Should we all be so impressed?

Your uninformed posts reek of fly-by Wikipedia and IMDB searching. Just a few posts up, you didn't even know what Sliders was. Now you're trying to discredit it. Much like the writing staff at BSG, you’re clearly just making things up as you go along. "I am Legend" floundered in Hollywood development hell for years and underwent multiple re-writes. That's like holding Ron Moore accountable for the lackluster Thing prequel/remake, which at one point he was attached.

You need to relax. At first I didn't know which show it was you were referring to. Then I saw Jerry O'Connell's mug, and the other guy's (totally forgot about Kari Wuhrer). I also remembered it being a prime time show in the '90s. I didn't know of its swan song on Sci Fi/SyFy. Yes, I checked the air dates. I did that because you were making some case for shows being cancelled to make room for BSG's budget (which I still don't think I buy).

I know I Am Legend got bounced around like a ball and had Tom Cruise attached to the project at one point. I made special mention of it because I love the novel and I did NOT want that movie to be made (again) because I knew they were going to wreck it. And guess what? I was right. Aside from a few choice tense moments, it's a piece of shit that has a stupid ending (theatrical cut) and wasted Alice Braga, who's a great talent, IMO.

Unlike you, I try to actually know what I'm talking about before I hail shit.

Unlike you, I don't throw out crap that can be scrutinized by checking data on IMDb. Bad for you, huh?

But to compare it to something as game-changing as Star Wars is laughable. As Monker noted, nu BSG has not left a dent on the pop cultural landscape. It was a critical darling, in the same way that the music press loves Elvis Costello and other artists nobody cares to listen to.

Never forget that Star Wars' success was a fluke. The last three movies were made for kids, too. It's all but acknowledged directly by Puke-us. Even Kevin Smith will tell you that (and he liked the prequels). What you see as game-changing is indeed game-changing — in marketing, not science fiction.

Now you're putting it on par with X-Files? Stop yanking me crank, bucko.

Why not? The X-Files was essentially Kolchak :The Night Stalker with a co-female lead. Like Sliders, Kolchak featured a great premise and was also underappreciated and short-lived. You prolly never watched either show, so just who are you to weigh in again anyway?

X-Files was a great show. Everyone knows it's an updated Kolchak (and they tried to bring back Kolchak a few years back, but it was cancelled in record time). Even the period with Doggett/Reyes wasn't too shabby. I still miss seeing Gillian every week. That last movie bombed but it was barely promoted and felt more like a "lost episode" than a feature film.

"More discerning viewers" for the most part were the GINOs — Galactic In Name Only haters who still want the '70s show replicated. At first, I wasn't too keen on the reboot, but I knew I'd definitely give it a fair shake. The miniseries clinched it. Likewise, the first two back-to-back episodes of the series proper ("33" and "Water") were excellent, and for a long time, that level of quality was maintained and then exceeded. It wasn't till the last season when things got sketchy, and then Moore left us doing some headscratching in the final hour. And gee-fucking-whiz was it better than than those gayass Stargate shows. More Sci Fi/SyFy fodder I couldn't bear to sit through. TransMorphers, anyone?

I’m not a GINO. I am just a guy that has watched way too much TV. BSG promised big things, but when it came time to deliver on its own grand designs, it failed. It desperately wanted to be Babylon 5, but they didn’t actually plan for the show to last. So what viewers ended up with was more like LOST in space.

Nothing wrong with trying to be on B5's level, qualitywise. That was a very good show that I really got into once Boxleitner came onboard. Now Boxleitner and Claudia Christian, there's a great male-female tandem (too bad she bailed). If you're suggesting Moore was trying to mimic it conceptually, I don't see why, because he had plenty of material to work with. When there's a story with a clear-cut beginning and end, the hardest part is filling in the middle, the points between. When the middle gets stretched because the network would like an additional season, since the show is doing well in the ratings, problems may arise if the ending (or what is supposed to be the ending) is compromised. Things might get a little weird, as they did at the very end of BSG. I think that's what you really have an issue with, not with the dramatic elements used to spin the saga along the way.

[The_Noble_Cause]

Are you really surprised? It wasn't a US production. It's not like nowadays, when stuff on both sides of the pond gets tossed back and forth like a jai alai ball.

Not the point. I said that Sliders was the US answer to Dr. Who. You disputed that, saying that Dr. Who was already on the air and going strong. As already pointed out, that was barely true.

No, I said that last I checked, it was "still going," which it is, for seven years now. I said that because I was unaware of exactly how long it had been off the air. I only knew that the initial run was a LONG one.

One of T.T.'s credits (as a producer, which could include script tinkering-with) is that crap remake of I Am Legend with Will Smith. Should we all be so impressed?

Your uninformed posts reek of fly-by Wikipedia and IMDB searching. Just a few posts up, you didn't even know what Sliders was. Now you're trying to discredit it. Much like the writing staff at BSG, you’re clearly just making things up as you go along. "I am Legend" floundered in Hollywood development hell for years and underwent multiple re-writes. That's like holding Ron Moore accountable for the lackluster Thing prequel/remake, which at one point he was attached.

You need to relax. At first I didn't know which show it was you were referring to. Then I saw Jerry O'Connell's mug, and the other guy's (totally forgot about Kari Wuhrer). I also remembered it being a prime time show in the '90s. I didn't know of its swan song on Sci Fi/SyFy. Yes, I checked the air dates. I did that because you were making some case for shows being cancelled to make room for BSG's budget (which I still don't think I buy).

I know I Am Legend got bounced around like a ball and had Tom Cruise attached to the project at one point. I made special mention of it because I love the novel and I did NOT want that movie to be made (again) because I knew they were going to wreck it. And guess what? I was right. Aside from a few choice tense moments, it's a piece of shit movie that has a stupid ending (theatrical cut) and wasted Alice Braga, who's a great talent, IMO.

Unlike you, I try to actually know what I'm talking about before I hail shit.

Unlike you, I don't throw out crap that can be scrutinized by checking data on IMDb. Bad for you, huh?

But to compare it to something as game-changing as Star Wars is laughable. As Monker noted, nu BSG has not left a dent on the pop cultural landscape. It was a critical darling, in the same way that the music press loves Elvis Costello and other artists nobody cares to listen to.

Never forget that Star Wars' success was a fluke. The last three movies were made for kids, too. It's all but acknowledged directly by Puke-us. Even Kevin Smith will tell you that (and he liked the prequels). What you see as game-changing is indeed game-changing — in marketing, not science fiction.

Now you're putting it on par with X-Files? Stop yanking me crank, bucko.

Why not? The X-Files was essentially Kolchak :The Night Stalker with a co-female lead. Like Sliders, Kolchak featured a great premise and was also underappreciated and short-lived. You prolly never watched either show, so just who are you to weigh in again anyway?

X-Files was a great show. Everyone knows it's an updated Kolchak (and they tried to bring back Kolchak a few years back, but it was cancelled in record time). Even the period with Doggett/Reyes wasn't too shabby. I still miss seeing Gillian every week. That last movie bombed but it was barely promoted and felt more like a "lost episode" than a feature film.

"More discerning viewers" for the most part were the GINOs — Galactic In Name Only haters who still want the '70s show replicated. At first, I wasn't too keen on the reboot, but I knew I'd definitely give it a fair shake. The miniseries clinched it. Likewise, the first two back-to-back episodes of the series proper ("33" and "Water") were excellent, and for a long time, that level of quality was maintained and then exceeded. It wasn't till the last season when things got sketchy, and then Moore left us doing some headscratching in the final hour. And gee-fucking-whiz was it better than than those gayass Stargate shows. More Sci Fi/SyFy fodder I couldn't bear to sit through. TransMorphers, anyone?

I’m not a GINO. I am just a guy that has watched way too much TV. BSG promised big things, but when it came time to deliver on its own grand designs, it failed. It desperately wanted to be Babylon 5, but they didn’t actually plan for the show to last. So what viewers ended up with was more like LOST in space.

Nothing wrong with trying to be on B5's level, qualitywise. That was a very good show that I really got into once Boxleitner came onboard. Now Boxleitner and Claudia Christian, there's a great male-female tandem (too bad she bailed). If you're suggesting Moore was trying to mimic it conceptually, I don't see why, because he had plenty of material to work with. When there's a story with a clear-cut beginning and end, the hardest part is filling in the middle, the points between. When the middle gets stretched because the network would like an additional season, since the show is doing well in the ratings, problems may arise if the ending (or what is supposed to be the ending) is compromised. Things might get a little weird, as they did at the every end of BSG. I think that's what you really have an issue with, not with the dramatic elements used to spin the saga along the way.

I'm tired of talking about this. As a viewer, BSG did not pay-off and I felt that Moore duped the fans. The Six/Baltar angel revelation was easily the most insipid TV wrap-up since the "it was all a dream" episode of Dallas. Just insultingly bad. In terms of science fiction, I don't think Star Wars or the revamped BSG were groundbreaking. Star Wars at least consistently entertained on a Buck Rogers-serial type level. The prequels were inconsequential. BSG, for the most part, was gravely serious and a bore. Current Dr. Who with Matt Smith is prolly the best sci-fi show on TV right now. At its best, it manages to be thought-provoking and fun.

I don't understand your "checking data on IMDB" comment at all.

[verslibre]

Good day, sir. Thanks for your time. A plethora of Journey threads for you to indulge. And Religion & Morality is down the hallway, to the left.

Peace, out!

P.S. Whatever your opinion may be, BSG was anything BUT boring. Obligatory eyeroll:

[G.I.Jim]

I only have one thing to say about this thread...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C3njjD41f48

[verslibre]

Believe me, you don't want to know what I say about guys who still cry themselves to sleep every night over Steve Perry.

[SF-Dano]

I dig the SF stuff, but this thread just reminds me of this

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AxAEo3CWeq8


.....and for the Religion and Morality thread

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YahNhXSD1Zs&feature

[conversationpc]

I dig the SF stuff, but this thread just reminds me of this

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AxAEo3CWeq8

[brywool]

One thing that would've helped those movies.
ACTORS.

Most of them came off really wooden.

[conversationpc]

One thing that would've helped those movies.
ACTORS.

Most of them came off really wooden.

I've long thought the LOTR movies had pretty good actors, for the most part (not the one playing Celeborn, for instance). Now, the ones in the latest three Star Wars movies are another story.

[brywool]

One thing that would've helped those movies.
ACTORS.

Most of them came off really wooden.

I've long thought the LOTR movies had pretty good actors, for the most part (not the one playing Celeborn, for instance). Now, the ones in the latest three Star Wars movies are another story.

agreed. The one where Natalie Portman and that other kid were rolling all over the grass was laughable...

[verslibre]

I dig the SF stuff, but this thread just reminds me of this

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AxAEo3CWeq8

Yeah, I love that! And the rest of Clerks 2!

Did you know Jeff Anderson isn't doing movies, anymore? Zack & Miri was his last one. Bummer. The guy's hilarious.

"There's only ONE Return...!"

[verslibre]

And for the record, I'm Randal Graves, and TNC is the guy who threw up!!