TAKE BACKS

[yogi]

If Dennis, Tommy & JY ( 3 main cogs) could do 1999 & The Brave New World album & possible tour over again what do you think would be done differently?????

[Monker]

If Dennis, Tommy & JY ( 3 main cogs) could do 1999 & The Brave New World album & possible tour over again what do you think would be done differently?????

Replace Dennis before they even started writing songs.

[FormerDJMike]

Monker is probably right but what we would've had was different cover art, less songs and more uniform production (because it would have been produced together instead of apart). Then after about a 50 date tour the band folds. The end.

[masque]

Monker is probably right but what we would've had was different cover art, less songs and more uniform production (because it would have been produced together instead of apart). Then after about a 50 date tour the band folds. The end.

^ this

[Toph]

Monker is probably right but what we would've had was different cover art, less songs and more uniform production (because it would have been produced together instead of apart). Then after about a 50 date tour the band folds. The end.

Without insulting a member, which is probably the only thing masque and monker know how to do, I'll answer the question in a different way. Scrap every song on the entire album except for Roseland,WTST, and Everything is Cool. Fast forward and put a number of songs from 100 years (title track, save me, rubicon, this time next year) and OWE, TATT, and waiting for our time of Cyclorama and you have an awesome album. Brave new World as it was was an awful album and had shitty songs from everyone on it. Pales in comparison to 100 years and Cyclo.

[yogi]

I believe that with 15 years of great hind sight what would have happened is the band would have gotten together for a final recording session of Brave New World. Songs such as Just Fell In, Hip Hop, Best New Face & Great Expectations would of been cut and more Styx type songs such as On My Way, Little Suzie etc.. would have been added.

Dennis and Tommy would have co produced the album with Tommy more in the drivers seat due to DDY's illness. Because of DDY's illness the band agrees to delay the albums release by 2 to 3 months and the tour is delayed 4 to 6 months. Glen is finally persuaded by Tommy and JY to tour again with Dennis as Dennis starts to feel better.

In the mean time with a push from the label Everything is Cool becomes a minor rock hit, but when Witness is released 2nd it cracks the top 25. Styx starts its headlining 30 city tour just as Witness is leaving the charts and Goodbye Roseland enters the charts. Roseland peaks @ #13 Styx wraps up their tour and heads off to the studio to record their follow up to Brave New World.

Styx does 35- 50 date summer tours most years with Tommy, Dennis & Glen doing some side projects.

In 2010 Styx has a huge album release and two DDY led songs both crack the top 10.Crossing The Rubicon peaks at #9 and the follow up to it, a remake of little known Canadian artist Lawerence Gowan's minor 80's hit 'A Criminal Mind' also peaks at #9. The Tommy Shaw led tune 'Everything All The Time' peaks then stalls at #13, and the Glen Burtnik led songs 'Bam' and 'Another' both crack the top 25. With Bam sitting on top of the top Billboards Top Rock song for 7 weeks. Their album: ' Gotta Love The Do Over' garners 3 Grammy nominations.

In 2011 Styx is elected into the Rock and roll Hall Of Fame and in 2015 they will release their fifth album since Brave New World was released back in 1999.

[Monker]

LOL...I did not insult anybody with my post. It is just the simple truth.

There is no way in hell Tommy and JY would go back in time an record BNW with Dennis. That's just a silly fantasy.

Monker is probably right but what we would've had was different cover art, less songs and more uniform production (because it would have been produced together instead of apart). Then after about a 50 date tour the band folds. The end.

Without insulting a member, which is probably the only thing masque and monker know how to do, I'll answer the question in a different way. Scrap every song on the entire album except for Roseland,WTST, and Everything is Cool. Fast forward and put a number of songs from 100 years (title track, save me, rubicon, this time next year) and OWE, TATT, and waiting for our time of Cyclorama and you have an awesome album. Brave new World as it was was an awful album and had shitty songs from everyone on it. Pales in comparison to 100 years and Cyclo.

[masque]

Monker is probably right but what we would've had was different cover art, less songs and more uniform production (because it would have been produced together instead of apart). Then after about a 50 date tour the band folds. The end.

Without insulting a member, which is probably the only thing masque and monker know how to do, I'll answer the question in a different way. Scrap every song on the entire album except for Roseland,WTST, and Everything is Cool. Fast forward and put a number of songs from 100 years (title track, save me, rubicon, this time next year) and OWE, TATT, and waiting for our time of Cyclorama and you have an awesome album. Brave new World as it was was an awful album and had shitty songs from everyone on it. Pales in comparison to 100 years and Cyclo.

sigh.......toph really????? me the "insulter"? you cant be serious........you are the poster child and the originator of the online insulter.

by "member", if you are insinuating member of the band and it is insulting that monker said "get rid of DDY".....that part wasnt what I mostly agreed with.....i was mostly in agreement with the comments about cover art, less songs, different production etc......i'll try to be more specific in the future to help eliminate igniting your sensitive and inflammatory thin skin.

if by "member", you mean other members on this message board.....then I challenge you to go back through my post history and I will be utterly shocked if you find any insults issued towards anyone on this message board.........other than you. and the majority of my "insults" hurled your direction are basically because after several years of watching you insult others and bully others I just decided to no longer to take your shit.

i have no desire to insult anyone on this board....once again, other than you, because I love the band and I love the members......where I live there arent too many folks around that want to discuss the current happenings or history of a band that had the majority of their success over 4 decades ago......so this community is a great outlet to still have conversations about a band I still care about and want to talk about. i dont want to fight about styx, i want to talk about styx.

your recent rating of the albums thread was super cool and I told you that several times.......I have no problem with you when you arent acting as the "village idiot" around here......you have proven to able to get along and contribute in positive ways......but it is usually short lived and you seem to thrive off of being a complete ass and stirring people up.......yet you struggle mightily when it comes back around towards you. but that is not surprising to me, as I have seen hundreds of people just like you throughout my life.....it's very sad and pathetic to see.......I cant imagine living with the insecurity that you and others like you must have to live with.....so in reality, deep down inside, I actually feel sorry for you.....

[Kilroy1983]

The past can not be changed anymore, but if there was this possibility it would be more interesting to Styx go back to 1983 and fix something than in 1999. Maybe then Styx could have had a new direction for the future. It is very evident that there was a big division among the main band members (Dennis vs. Tommy & JY ) since that time (1983).

[yogi]

You really don't have to go all the way back to 1983.

Once the Damn Yankees took a hiatus and Tommy did his great 7Deadly Zens album all was looking WAY WAY up on the Styx front. Dennis joined Tommy in Chicago on his Border's tour. The boyz were talking, getting along, and the Styx name was suddenly getting hot again.

They then got together and did a GREAT album & tour 'Return To Paradise'. Even their 20TH Anniversary Grand Illusion tour was successful but then..........

Enter Brave New World, Hunchback ,VW, Light Sensitivity and a bunch of my shi t don't stink cause 'Im a rock star attitudes. Then Gowan & then lawyer$$$$$$

This brings me to my 'Assembly Line' and the question: what if the members of Styx got TAKE BACKS starting in 1999.

[Boomchild]

The past can not be changed anymore, but if there was this possibility it would be more interesting to Styx go back to 1983 and fix something than in 1999. Maybe then Styx could have had a new direction for the future. It is very evident that there was a big division among the main band members (Dennis vs. Tommy & JY ) since that time (1983).

I feel that even if a "do over" was possible it wouldn't work. While these guys had great chemistry when it came to musical creativity, it seems that chemistry is not present when it comes to personalities. No matter what they did or would "do over" musically the end result would be the same. A clash of personalities.

[Monker]

The past can not be changed anymore, but if there was this possibility it would be more interesting to Styx go back to 1983 and fix something than in 1999. Maybe then Styx could have had a new direction for the future. It is very evident that there was a big division among the main band members (Dennis vs. Tommy & JY ) since that time (1983).

I feel that even if a "do over" was possible it wouldn't work. While these guys had great chemistry when it came to musical creativity, it seems that chemistry is not present when it comes to personalities. No matter what they did or would "do over" musically the end result would be the same. A clash of personalities.

You are exactly right.

Go back to Kilroy, what would happen? IMO, JY and Tommy would tell Dennis that if he nsists on Kilroy than they would replace him and he could do it solo.

And, knowing what he knows, Dennis would probably quit the band and release PT as a solo album and leave the band behind...and he probably wouldn't mind doing Kilroy solo...he could do it right and write and tell the story in a much better way. Then he could do Hunchback MUCH earlier and have more time for a solo career, or whatever he chose.

[Toph]

I'm talking about band members and you all tend to not be able to offer opinions without bashing DDY. Why is that? So, to get back to the question at hand. Brave New World is a disaster. It sucked. Yes, there are some bad DDY songs but there are worse Tommy Shaw songs. I Will Be Your Witness....GAY... Just Fell In....STUPID......Number One...OBNOXIOUS.....Best New Face.....BLAH......What Have They Done For You...SUCKS....Brave New World Reprise.....EAR SPLITTING......Fact of the matter is no one shines on BNW. It should never have been released. DDY was right. Its not just a missed opportunity. Its an abject failure.

[Monker]

I'm talking about band members and you all tend to not be able to offer opinions without bashing DDY.

NOBODY BASHED DDY IN THIS THREAD.

Find it. Quote it. PROVE it.

All I am saying is the rest of the band would rather continue Styx without DDY. if they could do it prior to BNW, they would. If they could avoid the debacle of Kilroy, they would.

This is stuff deep down you all probably agree with...and you know it. It's some weird fantasy that they would all suddenly get along and combine songs on albums in replace of BNW. They fired DDY once. They hated recording Kilroy. DDY went all Hunchback, even including a Hunchback song on BNW. Hell, his split devotions between life, Hunchback and Styx may have stressed him out enough to cause the light sensitivity in the first place. If they could do it all again, they'd simply release Cyclorama a few years earlier.

There is no reason any of them, including DDY, would want to risk going through all of that again.

Brave New World is a disaster. It sucked.

And, yet you think the band could go back in time and record different songs to make it better? Yeah, right..."my solo song is better than your solo song. " "It will only be good if I produce it...because only I know the sound of Styx." Give it up...it would be the same old crap with different songs...and the same disjointed sounding album.

Yes, there are some bad DDY songs but there are worse Tommy Shaw songs. I Will Be Your Witness....GAY.

I do believe there is a DDY interview on this very site where Dennis says it was a song that would have been a hit...but it fails because he didn't produce. Now, I will be insulting...that's ego and the attitude of a narcissist talking. it's a good song, regardless.

.. Just Fell In....STUPID......Number One...OBNOXIOUS.....Best New Face.....BLAH......What Have They Done For You...SUCKS....Brave New World Reprise.....EAR SPLITTING......

Blah, blah, blah. Nobody's arguing how good or bad BNW is in this thread. I do believe you started a thread for that...somewhere before the last hurray of the A&M era...and the coming threads of the post A&M era, which you never started.

[masque]

BNW is a split personality album.....the songs that are good I would consider average to above average solo material quality. there is one super standout on the album and that is "goodbye to roseland". that song is one of the better ones DDY ever wrote.

the main problem with the album for me is that there are at least 5 songs on this album that are truly awful and i'm embarrased they ever made the cut. they are;

best new face
fallen angel (although i do love the line about sincerity)
great expectations
high crimes and misdemeanors
just fell in

and there is "while there's still time"....which doesnt suck but is just the very kind of tune I cant really stand DDY doing.....so while i respect that it is well written it's a tune i do not like at all.

so that brings the total of songs I skip up to 6 now.

i will be your witness and everything is cool are just decent solo songs to me....so they dont thrill me too much.

so that's 8 songs that I either dont like at all or at the best are just OK. so that just leaves about 5 tunes that i actually enjoy most times.

and that's the problem with this album for me, in addition to the shitty artwork. so to me they had 5 good songs to build an album from and they could have included a couple of more and that would have been ok.......but that still left them at least 5 songs short of having something ready to release.

[ztyxlynne]

Dennis should of produced this album or at least let him do it with Tommy as co -producer. This whole album should be a do over. Why let JY have any input with his lack luster solo albums is beyond me. Did Tommy ever hear his solo work? Witness could of been a hit with Dennis producing. Goodbye Roseland is awesome. I love the lyric's . The rest toss. I was so disappointed when I heard this. The hard truth,tough love is they blew it. I don't even think the mentioned it on BTM.

[Boomchild]

To me BNW is just evidence that the wounds between them never fully healed. While they were able to handle doing a tour where they really only had to interact with each onstage for a few hours, they couldn't handle working closely together as in releasing a new album. Some may not agree with me but they all had issues when it came to working together. Somehow they were able to make it work for quite some time but then it fell apart. From that point on it would never be the same. We should be glad for the time it did work and what came out of that. Anything else beyond that is a pipe dream. Clearly they all seem to be doing fine and enjoying what they are doing. They are lucky to have the success they have had in recent years. Personally, even though I know that DDY had his issues I will never accept how JY etc. handled the parting of ways. By what DDY brought to the band over the long haul he deserved better then that. While a reunion at this point may be rewarding to them financially, on a personal level it would be worth nothing. IMHO